National Geographic — “UFO Whistleblower” (UFOs: Investigating the Unknown, full episode, 19 June 2025)
- Source: National Geographic, UFOs: Investigating the Unknown, episode “UFO Whistleblower” (full episode on the National Geographic YouTube channel), published 19 June 2025 (~44 min). https://youtu.be/zZLqFjG4HSo
- Format: documentary, narrated/anchored by journalists Leslie Kean and Ralph Blumenthal (the 2017 NYT / 2023 Debrief–Grusch reporters).
- Transcript pulled 2026-05-30 via YouTube caption API (
youtube_transcript.py). Lightly auto-formatted; speaker turns not individually attributed (documentary multi-voice). - Two through-lines: (1) the 26 July 2023 House Oversight UAP hearing (Grusch, Graves, Fravor) and the Schumer–Rounds UAP Disclosure Act; (2) the historical Donald Keyhoe / NICAP cycle (Mantell 1948, Projects Sign/Grudge/Blue Book, the Condon Committee) as a 70-year rhyme.
- Notable original content: an in-depth segment on the Vandenberg AFB 2003 “football-field red square” case with on-record first-hand witnesses Jeffrey Nuccetelli and Chaz King, a Security Forces blotter logged “Patrol Response, Unidentified Flying Object,” a “unauthorized aircraft landing” cover-brief, and an active AARO follow-up via Graves’s Merged podcast pipeline.
- Primary for vandenberg-afb-uap-2003; corroborating for grusch-whistleblower-testimony-2023 and congressional-action.
Notable on-record lines:
- Grusch: “Biologics came with some of these recoveries… Non-human… that was the assessment of people with direct knowledge on the program.”
- Karl Nell: “Non-human intelligence exists. Non-human intelligence has been interacting with humanity… there are unelected people in the government that are aware of that.”
- Skeptical counterweight (Blumenthal/others): Grusch “does not have firsthand evidence… That does not mean he’s lying… but it’s not the kind of evidence the public is gonna need.” “No, not evidence that would convince a skeptical scientist.” Kean/Blumenthal’s own net: the government likely covers up R&D and adversary tech, not “alien spacecraft and alien bodies.”
- Graves: ~5% pilot reporting rate; the Tic Tac “was far superior to anything we had.”
- Sen. Rounds: the Act got the National Archives collection but the independent review board was gutted by the House.
[00:00:00.233]
[00:00:01.801] [♪ mysterious music playing]
[00:00:04.937] -I love UFOs.
[00:00:06.572] And the reason I love
UFOs is ‘cause I don’t know
[00:00:09.241] what they are.
[00:00:11.144] -Hollywood has given us
three scenarios for our
[00:00:14.814] first contact with an
alien civilization…
[00:00:17.850] Invasion.
[00:00:19.385] [explosion]
[00:00:21.387] The radio message
from outer space.
[00:00:24.056] [electronic pulse]
[00:00:25.758] And then you have the lone,
stranded explorer scenario.
[00:00:31.197] Probably all 3 of them,
every bit of that, is wrong.
[00:00:36.435] -Oh my God!
[00:00:42.741] -The truth probably is
much more ambiguous and
[00:00:46.312] much more puzzling.
[00:00:48.314] -The US Navy has finally
acknowledged that videos
[00:00:50.282] appearing to show UFOS flying
through the air are real.
[00:00:53.786] [pilot] Oh, my gosh, dude.
[00:00:54.987] -The lead pilot saw an object
zip right by his aircraft.
[00:00:59.258] -It was white, pure white.
[00:01:02.061] It had no windows, no wings.
[00:01:05.464] -Like, what the
(bleep) was that?
[00:01:08.601] -In the last few years,
[00:01:10.569] we’ve gone from a
point where you couldn’t
[00:01:12.271] touch this subject,
to a point where the government
[00:01:14.807] acknowledges the videos
of UAP are authentic.
[00:01:18.244] -Now, we have a duty as
scientists to explain them.
[00:01:21.848] -More and more
scientists feel comfortable
[00:01:23.549] talking about this,
and even investigating it.
[00:01:26.218] -Most UAP sightings
are explainable.
[00:01:28.788] 98% of them.
[00:01:30.723] The 2% is what matters.
[00:01:32.692] -The hope is to find UAPs.
[00:01:35.428] Where are they hiding
and why are they here?
[00:01:39.131] -I had had a number of
very strange encounters.
[00:01:42.368] They were so intrusive
and so physical.
[00:01:46.272] -Alien abduction experiences
are a mystery to this day.
[00:01:50.275] -So many times I wondered
what they saw in me,
[00:01:54.313] it’s a profound question
to have for an entire life.
[00:01:58.017] -Maybe these people have
a common brain structure.
[00:02:00.487] Supposedly the government
has some things.
[00:02:03.055] Let’s get the data.
[00:02:05.258] -What do they have
inside the government?
[00:02:08.661] What do they actually
know about UFOs?
[00:02:12.165] And why can’t more be
released to the public?
[00:02:15.534] -I think belief is too easy.
[00:02:18.337] I think debunking is too easy.
[00:02:20.473] I think the truth of the
matter is way more complicated
[00:02:23.409] and way weirder.
[00:02:26.912] -We get reports every night.
[00:02:29.047] -I don’t know
what the hell it is.
[00:02:30.816] [overlapping radio chatter]
[00:02:34.286] [♪ theme music playing].
[00:02:45.531] -Americans will soon
learn more about UFOs.
[00:02:48.434] The House Oversight Committee
will hold a hearing on
[00:02:51.403] Unidentified Aerial Phenomenon.
[00:02:53.673] -It is going to be about
UAP whistleblower claims.
[00:02:57.043] Sort of the first of its kind.
[00:02:58.911] -If there’s one issue
that can bring Democrats
[00:03:00.679] and Republicans together,
it’s UFOs.
[00:03:03.382] -The House Oversight Committee
will hold a hearing on
[00:03:04.917] Unidentified Anomalous
Phenomena, UAPS…
[00:03:08.787] I prefer to call them UFOs.
[00:03:10.556] We’re going to get to the
bottom of it, daggummit,
[00:03:12.291] whatever the truth may be.
[00:03:18.764] -I’m about to walk into a
congressional hearing and
[00:03:20.933] witness something that I
never thought I would see.
[00:03:23.970] It’s the first hearing that
we’ve actually had witnesses
[00:03:26.705] to events speak at.
[00:03:30.309] Nothing like this has
ever happened before and
[00:03:31.444] we don’t know what
they’re going to say today.
[00:03:35.848] I’ve been writing and reporting
on UFOs for over 20 years.
[00:03:38.918] And all during those years,
[00:03:40.152] I was really up against the
belief that UFOs aren’t real.
[00:03:45.691] Saying UFOs are
real does not mean that
[00:03:47.660] they’re alien spacecraft.
[00:03:49.729] It just means these are real,
physical objects in our skies,
[00:03:53.032] and we don’t know
what they are.
[00:03:55.735] In 2017, I co-wrote a story
for the New York Times about a
[00:03:59.371] secret program within the
Department of Defense that was
[00:04:03.008] investigating UFOs and
no one knew about it.
[00:04:06.345] -The groundbreaking article
that Leslie and I and
[00:04:08.781] Helene Cooper wrote
revealed a secret
[00:04:10.983] Pentagon unit called AATIP,
that investigated these things,
[00:04:15.287] that according to
the government,
[00:04:16.789] officially didn’t exist.
[00:04:18.624] [Leslie Kean] The article also
included official Navy videos
[00:04:21.427] of unexplained objects
that pilots were witnessing.
[00:04:24.129] And we’d never seen
anything like that before.
[00:04:26.633] -The New York Times unveiled
the existence of a real-life
[00:04:29.535] X-Files Department…
[00:04:31.337] [Leslie Kean] It was
an explosive article,
[00:04:33.405] I mean front page
New York Times about UFOs.
[00:04:36.842] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
That article spurred an
[00:04:39.511] enormous amount of
Congressional interest.
[00:04:41.113] They redefined UFO to UAP:
[00:04:45.584] Unidentified
Anomalous Phenomena,
[00:04:48.621] to account for objects
that operate in space,
[00:04:51.858] in the air, and
potentially underwater.
[00:04:56.862] So Congress recognizes
that there is a major
[00:05:00.366] national security risk of
unidentified objects passing
[00:05:04.570] through restricted,
sensitive airspace.
[00:05:09.141] After learning about AATIP,
[00:05:10.943] Congress formalizes
the mission and forms the
[00:05:13.011] UAP Task Force,
[00:05:15.414] which then eventually
becomes what we have now,
[00:05:18.083] the All Domain Anomaly
Resolution Office.
[00:05:21.254] Leave it to the government
to come up with wonderful
[00:05:23.789] acronyms and names.
[00:05:25.124] AARO.
[00:05:27.593] And that is the entity that
is now the official government
[00:05:31.130] UFO analysis office.
[00:05:36.502] -So, the 2017 article kind of
changed the climate on UFOs.
[00:05:43.108] And then a few years later,
[00:05:46.545] I was introduced to a
man named David Grusch.
[00:05:50.983] He was an intelligence official
who wanted to come forward with
[00:05:53.919] some very stunning revelations.
[00:05:57.489] So Ralph and l wrote a story
for an online publication
[00:06:00.959] called The Debrief and now,
[00:06:04.797] two months after
the David Grusch story
[00:06:06.632] was published, a House
oversight committee is holding
[00:06:09.501] an open hearing and our
article helped pave the way.
[00:06:16.208] People are lining up
outside the building to get in.
[00:06:19.211] They flew in from all over
the place, even overseas.
[00:06:23.015] How early did you
guys get in line?
[00:06:25.785] -Uh, 3:30 a.m., 3:16.
[00:06:28.053] -Incredible! Really?
-Yeah.
[00:06:31.089] [Leslie Kean] There are three
witnesses being called today,
[00:06:33.592] but the first person that
people really want to hear from
[00:06:36.895] is whistleblower David Grusch.
[00:06:41.567] -The subcommittee hearing on
[00:06:42.868] Unidentified Anomalous
Phenomena or UAPs,
[00:06:46.205] will come to order.
[00:06:48.173] Mr. Grusch…
[00:06:50.409] -Mr. Chairman, ranking
members, and congressmen.
[00:06:52.911] My name is
David Charles Grusch.
[00:06:55.013] I was an intelligence
officer for 14 years.
[00:06:57.617] My testimony is based on
information I’ve been given by
[00:07:00.252] individuals with a
longstanding track record of
[00:07:03.856] legitimacy and
service to this country.
[00:07:07.659] Many of whom…
[00:07:08.694] [Leslie Kean] David Grusch
worked for both the
[00:07:10.629] National Reconnaissance Office
[00:07:11.997] and the National Geospatial-
Intelligence Agency.
[00:07:15.501] He had very high clearances
within those agencies and
[00:07:18.504] he was the representative
sent to the UAP task force
[00:07:23.042] when it was in operation.
[00:07:25.077] He started looking into the
questions of crashed retrieved
[00:07:27.980] objects within various programs
that may have been hidden away.
[00:07:31.917] He told us for our article that
he had evidence which he had
[00:07:35.854] gained from 40 people he
interviewed at high levels,
[00:07:38.857] that the government,
[00:07:40.559] or some agency
within the government,
[00:07:42.594] possessed craft of
non-human origin.
[00:07:46.666] [Ralph Blumenthal] He was
talking about things that no
[00:07:48.534] country on earth could produce.
[00:07:50.469] Alien spacecraft, I mean,
there’s no other way to put it.
[00:07:54.607] [Leslie Kean] He claimed that
he could not be shown the craft,
[00:07:57.309] but he was shown
documentation, photographs,
[00:08:00.612] and was able to gather very,
[00:08:02.648] very specific information
from people directly involved.
[00:08:06.585] [Marik Von Rennenkampff] He
alleges that the government
[00:08:08.754] is operating a decades-long
UFO retrieval and reverse
[00:08:13.225] engineering effort, illegally,
[00:08:15.928] outside of the purview
and oversight of Congress.
[00:08:19.398] [Leslie Kean] Oversight was
not being provided to programs
[00:08:22.168] which were legally
required to have oversight,
[00:08:25.204] and he felt it was his
obligation to report them.
[00:08:28.307] -I have taken every step I can
to corroborate this evidence
[00:08:30.976] over a period of four years
while I was with the
[00:08:34.212] UAP task force
[00:08:35.380] and do my due diligence
on the individual sharing it.
[00:08:39.651] I became a whistleblower
through a urgent concern filing
[00:08:42.888] in May 2022 with the
Intelligence Community
[00:08:46.592] Inspector General.
[00:08:49.127] -Mr. Grusch, why did you
come forward on this issue?
[00:08:52.264] -Purely a sense of duty.
[00:08:54.099] I first swore an oath when
I was a cadet 18 years ago,
[00:08:56.735] and I still uphold that
even out of the uniform.
[00:09:00.939] [Leslie Kean] During the time
that he gave the information to
[00:09:03.375] the Inspector General,
[00:09:04.843] he was under oath and
the ICIG had ruled that
[00:09:08.847] what he told them
was credible and urgent.
[00:09:11.517] -I was informed in the course
of my official duties of a
[00:09:15.120] multi-decade UAP
crash retrieval and reverse
[00:09:19.124] engineering program.
[00:09:21.360] [Garrett Graff] A lot of
eyebrows went up both in the
[00:09:23.395] room and people who
were watching that live
[00:09:26.765] around the country.
[00:09:29.401] As someone covering
national security in Washington,
[00:09:32.738] I got interested in UFOs,
[00:09:34.673] not as someone who
was raised on Star Trek,
[00:09:37.709] but because I began
to see serious people talking
[00:09:41.313] seriously about this subject.
[00:09:44.816] UFOs are real, you know,
[00:09:46.886] we know that there
are unidentified objects
[00:09:50.155] in our airspace.
[00:09:52.424] Even John Brennan,
[00:09:54.026] the former CIA director,
has said, effectively,
[00:09:57.996] “There’s weird stuff
out there flying around.
[00:10:00.732] We don’t know what it is.
It puzzles me.”
[00:10:19.818] -I figure there can’t
be that many things that
[00:10:22.688] puzzle John Brennan.
[00:10:26.224] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
There’s no question that the
[00:10:28.226] government retrieves objects
that may have been abandoned or
[00:10:30.929] recovered from adversaries.
[00:10:34.700] [Garrett Graff] The US
government has had a UFO crash
[00:10:37.035] retrieval program for 100 years.
[00:10:40.172] UFO in this case though,
[00:10:41.707] doesn’t necessarily
mean alien spacecraft.
[00:10:43.809] You know, this is how,
in World War II,
[00:10:46.011] this unit was able
to get its hands on crashed
[00:10:48.947] Japanese Zeros or
in the Cold War,
[00:10:52.151] Soviet MIG fighters.
[00:10:54.720] -Dave Grusch is alleging
something different, something,
[00:10:57.756] you know, quite
more extraordinary.
[00:10:59.758] Evidence of extraterrestrial
or off-Earth technology.
[00:11:04.897] I think, you know, he presented
as a very credible person
[00:11:09.301] in that he was an
intelligence officer,
[00:11:11.403] he had security clearances.
[00:11:12.538] So this isn’t somebody
walking in from the outside.
[00:11:15.941] This is an insider.
[00:11:17.776] -You say that the government
is in possession of potentially
[00:11:20.112] non-human spacecraft,
[00:11:22.147] do you believe our
government has made contact
[00:11:24.015] with intelligent
extraterrestrials?
[00:11:27.286] -That’s something I can’t
discuss in a public setting.
[00:11:30.922] -If you believe we have
crashed craft as stated earlier,
[00:11:34.459] do we have the bodies of the
pilots who piloted this craft?
[00:11:37.863] -Biologics came with
some of these recoveries.
[00:11:40.532] Yeah.
[00:11:42.601] -Were they, I guess human
or non-human biologics?
[00:11:46.404] -Non-human.
[00:11:47.605] And that was the assessment
of people with direct knowledge
[00:11:49.407] on the program I talked
to that are currently still
[00:11:51.143] on the program.
[00:11:53.912] [Garrett Graff]
Non-human biologics.
[00:11:55.447] Effectively alien bodies.
[00:11:58.150] You know, this is the
biggest possible secret that
[00:12:01.787] you could imagine any
government really keeping.
[00:12:05.524] [Leslie Kean] To be sitting
there and hearing members of
[00:12:08.026] Congress asking these questions
in a very serious context
[00:12:12.264] was just astonishing.
[00:12:14.366] -But as I stand
here under oath now,
[00:12:16.301] I am speaking to the facts
as I’ve been told them.
[00:12:19.504] I am driven by a commitment of
both the truth and transparency.
[00:12:23.909] I’m asking Congress to
hold our government to this
[00:12:26.144] standard and thoroughly
investigate these claims.
[00:12:29.381] I am hopeful that my actions
will ultimately lead to a
[00:12:32.984] positive outcome of
increased transparency.
[00:12:37.422] [Leslie Kean] The congressional
hearing in July of 2023
[00:12:40.759] isn’t the first time that
we’ve had individuals advocating
[00:12:43.995] for greater transparency
and trying to undo the secrecy
[00:12:47.332] involved with the UFO issue.
[00:12:50.970] [Garrett Graff]
Across all of human history,
[00:12:53.438] people have seen strange
things in the sky.
[00:12:56.541] We see this, particularly In
the early years of the
[00:12:59.277] Flying Saucer era,
[00:13:01.313] the late 1940s
and early 1950s,
[00:13:03.882] as pop culture and
Hollywood movies began to
[00:13:06.885] link the ideas of UFOs and
flying saucers with aliens.
[00:13:14.492] And key among that interest
was a former military officer
[00:13:21.000] named Donald Keyhoe
[00:13:23.402] -Our first guest on
To Tell the Truth
[00:13:25.337] is one of the world’s
leading authorities on
[00:13:27.372] unidentified flying objects.
[00:13:29.908] What is your name, please?
[00:13:32.410] -My name is Donald Keyhoe.
[00:13:36.314] -My name is Donald Keyhoe.
[00:13:39.985] -My name is Donald Keyhoe.
[00:13:41.753] -Only one of these gentlemen
is the real Donald Keyhoe.
[00:13:45.925] [Christopher Mellon]
Major Donald Keyhoe is one
[00:13:48.126] of a number of people,
[00:13:49.762] who encountered
the UFO issue,
[00:13:52.063] were initially skeptical,
but the more they learned,
[00:13:54.332] the more they began to realize
there’s something going on here.
[00:13:57.969] -Now they do come in
sort of different shapes
[00:14:00.105] and sizes, right?
[00:14:01.640] -Uh, the main…
[00:14:02.808] …Most of the sightings
describe disk-shaped objects.
[00:14:05.210] [Garrett Graff] Donald Keyhoe
was a respected
[00:14:07.579] former military officer.
[00:14:09.882] He gets interested in this
subject of flying saucers and
[00:14:13.184] UFOs after being asked to
look into it by the editor of
[00:14:17.322] True Magazine,
[00:14:19.457] one of the nation’s
leading sci-fi and paranormal
[00:14:22.694] magazines of that era.
[00:14:26.398] -Keyhoe had begun as
an airplane pilot.
[00:14:29.901] Then a writer.
[00:14:31.569] He began to write
for True Magazine.
[00:14:36.374] In 1949, the editor
somehow learned that pilots
[00:14:42.781] were reporting strange
things in the sky,
[00:14:46.618] that the Air Force
was denying it,
[00:14:48.554] and he felt this
needed to be looked at.
[00:14:50.856] And Keyhoe,
because of his background,
[00:14:53.425] was given the assignment.
[00:14:56.328] -He particularly becomes
interested in the case of
[00:14:58.663] Captain Thomas Mantell.
[00:15:01.667] Mantell, a decorated Kentucky
Air National Guard pilot,
[00:15:05.437] World War II veteran, is
dispatched to investigate the
[00:15:10.575] sighting of a UFO over
the skies of Kentucky.
[00:15:24.155] [Garrett Graff] Mantell spots
it in the sky and sends back a
[00:15:28.026] series of radio messages.
[00:15:44.275] [Garrett Graff] And then
all contact with him is lost.
[00:15:55.553] [reporter] Mantell had
crashed 5 miles southwest
[00:15:58.056] of Franklin, Kentucky.
[00:15:59.958] Captain Mantell was killed.
[00:16:09.334] [Garrett Graff] This is
probably the nation’s first
[00:16:12.671] UFO-related fatality.
[00:16:16.775] It’s only years later, the
Air Force puts together,
[00:16:20.278] through, you know, various
military and Navy records,
[00:16:24.382] that the path of a secret
research balloon would have
[00:16:28.653] almost exactly matched
the path of the object
[00:16:32.157] that Mantel encountered.
[00:16:33.992] [Linda Powell] But for
Keyhoe and many others,
[00:16:35.994] his crash has never been
adequately explained.
[00:16:39.865] Keyhoe went to the Pentagon
and asked them about this
[00:16:44.102] sighting but he didn’t
come away any the wiser.
[00:16:48.740] [Garrett Graff] Donald Keyhoe
remained convinced
[00:16:51.076] that the government
was covering up the truth.
[00:16:56.614] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
There’s been a long history of
[00:16:58.416] public perception of coverups
and nefarious activities
[00:17:02.153] by the government.
[00:17:03.354] That a very, very credible
individuals like David Grusch
[00:17:07.525] are bringing back to the fore.
[00:17:09.628] -Mr. Grusch,
are you aware of any individuals
[00:17:12.097] that are participating in
reverse engineering programs
[00:17:14.365] for non-terrestrial craft?
[00:17:16.268] -Personally, yes. Mmm-hmm.
-Have you seen the spacecraft?
[00:17:21.406] -I have to be
careful to describe what
[00:17:23.675] I’ve seen firsthand,
and not in this environment,
[00:17:26.578] but I can answer that
question behind closed doors.
[00:17:29.448] -Okay.
And so, with that being said…
[00:17:31.783] -The controversy surrounding
David and his testimony
[00:17:33.651] is that he doesn’t have
firsthand knowledge.
[00:17:35.620] He has not seen
any such craft.
[00:17:37.622] It’s all secondhand.
[00:17:39.524] -He would have very
legitimate bans on being able
[00:17:43.595] to talk about so-called
special access programs that
[00:17:46.664] he was a part of.
[00:17:48.366] It could lead to jail terms
if you disclose knowledge of
[00:17:51.536] classified material that
you are sworn to protect
[00:17:55.040] and keep secret.
[00:17:57.376] [Shane Harris] The question
of whether the government
[00:17:58.910] has already
recovered evidence of
[00:18:01.913] extraterrestrial existence
and is covering it up.
[00:18:05.784] I mean, that’s the part that
I’m just really skeptical of.
[00:18:08.953] And even someone like
Dave Grusch, who again,
[00:18:11.256] is a very compelling
witness by his own testimony
[00:18:15.326] does not have
firsthand evidence of what he
[00:18:17.328] claims to exist.
[00:18:18.864] That does not mean
that he’s lying.
[00:18:20.598] It doesn’t mean
that he’s wrong,
[00:18:21.933] but it’s not the kind of
evidence that I think the
[00:18:23.768] public is gonna need to really
believe that the government is
[00:18:27.639] hiding existence
of terrestrials.
[00:18:30.542] -I think everybody wants to
see that picture of that craft.
[00:18:33.945] In Grusch’s defense,
[00:18:35.947] he had already provided
classified details such as
[00:18:39.484] program names,
the people allegedly involved,
[00:18:41.786] and the locations of where
craft apparently are stored,
[00:18:44.856] in many hours of closed
briefings to Congress.
[00:18:48.793] -Is there evidence
that there are aliens?
[00:18:50.695] -No, not evidence
that would convince a
[00:18:52.797] skeptical scientist, no.
[00:18:54.733] There are people
holding their hand up,
[00:18:56.668] swearing to tell the
truth in Congress.
[00:18:58.936] That’s not how we establish
objective truths in science.
[00:19:02.474] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
But it wasn’t just David Grusch
[00:19:04.976] making these allegations.
[00:19:06.077] A former high-level army
officer who worked on the
[00:19:09.547] UFO problem for
the government,
[00:19:11.249] named Karl Nell also
supported Grusch’s allegation.
[00:19:15.187] [Karl Nell] Non-human
intelligence exists.
[00:19:17.422] Non-human intelligence has
been interacting with humanity.
[00:19:20.592] This interaction is not
new and it’s been ongoing and
[00:19:24.829] there are unelected people
in the government that are
[00:19:27.632] aware of that.
[00:19:28.733] David Grusch has
said the same thing.
[00:19:30.668] David Grusch cleared for
presidentially level material.
[00:19:34.038] So you’re looking at people
that are in a position to know
[00:19:37.542] this and they’re telling
you the same thing.
[00:19:42.947] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
The Congressional hearing was
[00:19:44.649] fascinating because there were
two narratives all about UFOs.
[00:19:49.621] One narrative is that the
government is withholding an
[00:19:52.690] extraordinary secret
from the American public.
[00:19:55.493] And the other is the fact that
military aircrews and aviators
[00:20:00.898] are observing objects,
not just with eyeballs,
[00:20:04.970] but with multiple
sensors, radar, infrared.
[00:20:08.873] -As we convene here,
UAP are in our airspace,
[00:20:11.810] but they’re grossly
under-reported.
[00:20:13.812] These sightings are not rare
or isolated, they are routine.
[00:20:16.648] -Ryan Graves was
there because he had been
[00:20:19.517] reporting Navy sightings.
[00:20:21.653] Some of the pilots in Ryan’s
squadron had been picking up
[00:20:24.622] strange objects on radar and
actually had a near collision
[00:20:28.459] with one of them.
[00:20:30.395] After hearing about
these encounters,
[00:20:32.597] Ryan Graves realized
that this was a safety issue.
[00:20:37.402] And Commander David Fravor
was there as a witness to
[00:20:40.438] the 2004 Nimitz incident,
the famous Tic Tac case,
[00:20:44.642] which was one of
the best-researched
[00:20:46.010] UFO cases ever.
[00:20:49.647] He was a Navy pilot
flying off the USS Nimitz.
[00:20:53.117] They’d been picking up these
fast-moving objects on radar.
[00:20:56.321] He described it as
like a ping-pong ball
[00:20:58.489] zig-zagging around,
no signs of propulsion.
[00:21:02.126] -The Tic Tac object we
engaged in 2004 was far superior
[00:21:04.862] to anything we had on time,
have today,
[00:21:07.332] or are looking to develop
in the next ten years.
[00:21:12.437] -I have a few questions
for Mr. Graves.
[00:21:14.673] What percentage
of UAP sightings,
[00:21:16.607] in your belief,
go unreported by our pilots?
[00:21:19.410] -I would estimate
we’re somewhere near
[00:21:20.945] 5% reporting perhaps.
[00:21:22.814] -So like 95%
basically don’t report?
[00:21:25.617] -That’s just my
personal estimate.
[00:21:29.120] In the late 2013-2014
time period,
[00:21:32.023] that’s when we first
started to notice that there
[00:21:34.959] were other objects
in the area with us.
[00:21:43.901] -Frankly, I was scared
that someone was going to hit
[00:21:46.471] one of these.
[00:21:47.439] And that’s really what
pushed me over the edge
[00:21:49.708] to speak publicly about this.
[00:21:52.777] I knew this hearing would be
an extremely important venue
[00:21:55.613] to be able to communicate
for all these pilots and
[00:21:58.850] military operators that
had been reaching out to me
[00:22:01.586] to share what they
had been going through.
[00:22:04.122] Folks like Jeffery Nuccetelli,
[00:22:06.090] a former security officer
at Vandenberg Air Force Base.
[00:22:12.497] -Leading up to that hearing,
[00:22:14.966] it’s hard to describe
how I was feeling.
[00:22:17.835] The anticipation,
[00:22:19.003] I’ve been waiting for this
for it seems like my whole life.
[00:22:24.208] To me, it was like watching
the biggest Super Bowl ever.
[00:22:27.678] And then
Representative Luna brought up
[00:22:29.514] the Vandenberg case…
[00:22:31.049] -My next question would
actually be for Mr. Graves…
[00:22:34.686] -And I literally
fell out of my chair.
[00:22:37.255] I literally could not
believe it was happening.
[00:22:39.991] -Can you please explain to
me in detail the event that
[00:22:43.561] occurred at
Vandenberg Air Force Base?
[00:22:46.831] -Certainly.
[00:22:50.201] In the 2003 timeframe,
[00:22:52.503] a large group of Boeing
contractors were operating
[00:22:54.672] near one of the
launch facilities at
[00:22:56.073] Vandenberg
Air Force Base.
[00:22:58.709] -I was stationed there in 2003.
[00:23:01.212] At that time it was part of US
Space Command and our primary
[00:23:04.849] mission was to develop tests
and launch space assets.
[00:23:09.187] Rockets and test technology
to defend the country against
[00:23:12.957] incoming ballistic missiles and
other threats of that nature.
[00:23:17.161] The day began as a normal day.
[00:23:19.864] I showed up to work
and as I pulled in,
[00:23:22.800] I could tell that there
was something going on.
[00:23:26.070] Just all of a sudden everyone
starts to try to tell me this
[00:23:29.006] story about a real-world
UFO event that had
[00:23:32.810] occurred that morning.
[00:23:34.812] -They observed a
very large red square,
[00:23:38.549] estimated to be
almost the size
[00:23:39.750] of a football field,
[00:23:41.353] approach the base
from the ocean and
[00:23:43.154] hover at
low altitude
[00:23:44.655] over one of the
launch facilities.
[00:23:47.025] This object remained for about
45 seconds or so before darting
[00:23:50.661] off over the mountains.
[00:23:56.267] -Very quickly I realized,
you know,
[00:23:58.002] that this is not a joke.
[00:23:59.537] They’re not pranking me,
[00:24:00.972] that this is a real
event that occurred.
[00:24:06.511] And then sometime after dark,
[00:24:09.480] a radio transmission
came in over the net.
[00:24:12.250] “Be advised, we have
strange lights over the ocean.”
[00:24:18.623] -My name is Chaz King.
[00:24:20.658] I was on duty the
night of the incident.
[00:24:25.530] Probably between 12:00
and 1:00 in the morning,
[00:24:27.899] we were all in the
intra-control facility,
[00:24:29.734] which is kinda like
a big glass building
[00:24:31.937] that oversees everything.
[00:24:36.107] It started out
as, like, a big ball light
[00:24:37.875] over the ocean
off the coast.
[00:24:40.745] Everyone kind of
was like, okay,
[00:24:41.913] sometimes we have planes
fly into the flight line area.
[00:24:44.916] Just got our attention but
nothing out of the ordinary
[00:24:48.319] until it started
to come towards
[00:24:50.087] our position.
[00:24:52.357] -I was getting ready to
jump in my car and head
[00:24:54.258] to that location.
[00:24:56.527] And then just all
hell broke loose.
[00:24:59.297] The radio transmissions
start to pour in.
[00:25:01.999] People started to scream.
[00:25:04.602] -As it became
closer and closer
[00:25:06.637] to our position,
[00:25:07.772] you could no longer
see the light.
[00:25:08.940] You could just
see a massive object
[00:25:10.207] in the sky.
[00:25:11.576] It stopped
and hovered,
[00:25:12.843] right over
the coastline.
[00:25:13.945] It was
so massive,
[00:25:14.880] it was almost like a
football field long.
[00:25:17.082] There was no propulsion
systems, no lights,
[00:25:19.651] no audible sounds,
[00:25:21.953] and it just
hovered there.
[00:25:24.655] I remember
the five of us
[00:25:25.990] looking at
each other,
[00:25:27.024] kinda dumbfounded,
in disbelief.
[00:25:29.394] There was excitement,
a little bit of fear,
[00:25:31.762] a little bit of panic,
a lot of chaos.
[00:25:34.532] [Jeffrey Nuccetelli] And
that’s when it became very
[00:25:35.967] difficult to hear
the transmissions.
[00:25:37.769] These are people
I’d spent years with.
[00:25:41.072] We were very close,
[00:25:42.807] and they’re not people
that are easily frightened
[00:25:45.109] or intimidated, and
they were frightened and they
[00:25:47.878] were terrified and they were
screaming for help over the net.
[00:25:52.617] [Chaz King] After a few seconds
we kind of sprung into action.
[00:25:54.318] That’s what we’re
trained to do,
[00:25:56.187] but then it just shot
away up the coastline,
[00:25:58.389] seemed like it was a
million miles an hour,
[00:25:59.991] like it was shot out of a
cannon and then it was gone.
[00:26:04.895] -Was this documented in
any official form whether
[00:26:07.231] it was a police blotter?
[00:26:08.933] -Yes, they had official
documentation and records from
[00:26:11.369] the event that the witness
held over the years.
[00:26:15.072] -So this is the
Security Forces blotter,
[00:26:17.208] and this is the actual
record of the event.
[00:26:23.948] The title is Patrol Response,
Unidentified Flying Object.
[00:26:28.720] So that’s how it was
officially logged, as a UFO.
[00:26:35.059] [Chaz King] We
received a briefing,
[00:26:36.193] the next tour of duty,
[00:26:37.428] that it was an
unauthorized aircraft landing.
[00:26:39.930] And I remember all of
us kind of looking at
[00:26:42.133] each other puzzled.
[00:26:43.367] One, it never landed.
[00:26:45.102] Two, the airfield wasn’t
even open that day.
[00:26:49.173] I know personally,
I can’t explain it.
[00:26:50.741] I’ve never seen anything
like it in my life.
[00:26:53.878] The way it hovered,
to make no sound,
[00:26:56.114] to have no
propulsion system.
[00:26:58.082] Our aircraft
don’t do that.
[00:27:01.085] [Jeffrey Nuccetelli]
At the time,
[00:27:02.219] I didn’t know what
to think other than,
[00:27:04.321] this is extraordinary.
[00:27:07.091] We didn’t have any kind of
protocols in place to deal with
[00:27:09.894] an incident like that.
[00:27:11.896] But we upchannelled
all the information that we had
[00:27:14.198] to higher headquarters.
[00:27:16.134] And then we would drive
around just trying to keep an
[00:27:18.736] eye on the sky.
[00:27:25.710] [Jeffrey Nuccetelli]
Me and the people that
[00:27:26.844] experienced the
Vandenberg encounters,
[00:27:29.647] we talked about
it pretty regularly for a while.
[00:27:34.452] [Chaz King] Having conversations
with family members, friends,
[00:27:37.388] “Do you think it was,
you know, an alien?
[00:27:39.490] Do you think it was this?”
[00:27:40.758] I can only describe that,
[00:27:42.126] I’ve never seen
anything like it.
[00:27:44.695] You’re always
looking at the sky,
[00:27:46.030] wondering will it come back?
[00:27:47.331] What was it?
[00:27:48.466] And then, you know,
[00:27:49.667] 20 years later I’d kinda
locked it away after being told
[00:27:52.803] to just forget about it.
[00:27:54.839] -Some people believed it,
other people didn’t.
[00:27:57.308] And some people got
very uncomfortable.
[00:27:59.677] And we realized, people really
don’t know this is real,
[00:28:04.582] and they think that we’re,
you know, we’re making it up.
[00:28:09.820] After a while I really
just quit talking about it.
[00:28:12.824] There was really nowhere to go,
[00:28:15.593] and then I found the
Merged podcast with Ryan.
[00:28:21.966] -Welcome to Merged.
I’m Ryan Graves.
[00:28:24.201] I wanted to create a platform
where pilots and reputable
[00:28:28.072] professionals could
discuss this topic,
[00:28:31.042] safe from ridicule.
[00:28:33.411] -I said, this guy seems like
someone that I can trust,
[00:28:36.447] that will take me seriously.
[00:28:38.516] And I stayed up all night
one night typing up emails.
[00:28:44.088] It took a lot of courage,
but I hit that send button,
[00:28:47.024] and I think within
hours he replied.
[00:28:50.428] And then things moved
very rapidly from there.
[00:28:53.564] Ryan introduced me
to some lawmakers,
[00:28:56.467] and then eventually to
the investigators at AARO.
[00:28:59.303] So I provided them all
the documentation I had,
[00:29:01.806] I gave them additional
witnesses that they could
[00:29:03.874] follow up on.
[00:29:05.276] They’re looking for
historical records that could
[00:29:07.545] back up the story.
[00:29:08.680] And they’re gonna find if
there is any radar data.
[00:29:11.515] Vandenberg is
covered in cameras.
[00:29:13.450] There might be some
video or still pictures.
[00:29:17.354] Hopefully, they can get
enough information where they
[00:29:20.024] can try to resolve the case.
[00:29:41.045] -Jeff, thanks for
joining me today.
[00:29:42.313] -Thank you for having me.
It’s a pleasure.
[00:29:44.215] [Jeffrey Nuccetelli] I ended up
being invited onto the podcast,
[00:29:47.084] and I thought to myself,
[00:29:48.452] you know, what are
you doing, man?
[00:29:50.187] You’re getting ready to go
out in front of the whole world
[00:29:52.423] and talk about UFOs.
[00:29:54.325] We want the stigma reduced.
[00:29:56.460] The big shift now are people
like you and some of the other
[00:30:01.165] people that are,
[00:30:03.033] have come out in
the open and be like,
[00:30:04.902] these events are real.
[00:30:06.170] They’re happening.
[00:30:07.304] We’re in the fight now.
[00:30:08.505] -One step at a time.
[00:30:09.607] Well, Jeff, thanks
for coming on…
[00:30:10.775] [Jeffrey Nuccetelli] I think
the more witnesses we can
[00:30:13.210] encourage to come out,
especially if they have some
[00:30:15.045] kind of data or evidence,
[00:30:17.314] the stronger position
that we will be in to force
[00:30:21.185] the government to disclose.
[00:30:27.291] -Major Keyhoe, you will
agree that most people in the
[00:30:29.393] United States don’t
believe in flying saucers
[00:30:32.696] from outer space.
[00:30:33.897] They probably hold the view
of Columnist Bob Considine,
[00:30:37.735] who wrote that flying
saucers are products of,
[00:30:42.173] for the most part,
[00:30:43.507] “pranksters, half-wits,
cranks, publicity hounds,
[00:30:48.446] fanatics in general,
and screwballs.”
[00:30:51.949] -Well I wish I could show
him at any time a list of
[00:30:54.919] about 800 witnesses,
[00:30:56.487] some of the
big names in aviation,
[00:30:58.255] including up to the rank
of Colonel in the Air Force.
[00:31:00.892] If they’re screwballs
and incompetents,
[00:31:02.993] why are they still on the job?
[00:31:06.597] [Leslie Kean] In the
late 40s and early 50s,
[00:31:08.499] there were sightings
across the United States.
[00:31:11.202] It was in the middle
of the Cold War,
[00:31:12.937] so government officials
were trying to figure out
[00:31:15.272] what these objects were.
[00:31:17.675] -The government set up a
series of research programs
[00:31:22.913] charged by the Air Force with
investigating UFO claims and
[00:31:27.718] trying to solve the mystery.
[00:31:29.820] First was Project Sign,
then Project Grudge,
[00:31:33.991] then Project Blue Book.
[00:31:35.927] [reporter] Project Blue Book
investigated 12,518 sightings.
[00:31:41.231] [Garrett Graff] With time,
these projects would end up
[00:31:43.300] running for about
a quarter century.
[00:31:45.369] -Donald Keyhoe was
interested in all sightings.
[00:31:48.672] And of course, the project
Blue Book sightings were of
[00:31:51.408] tremendous interest to him.
[00:31:55.312] [Leslie Kean] Project Blue Book
would often issue very silly
[00:31:58.248] explanations for cases that
did not seem to fit the case.
[00:32:03.354] [Linda Powell] They were birds,
the planet Venus, a balloon,
[00:32:08.492] seagulls were favored
as being the culprits.
[00:32:12.429] -They ignored lots of cases,
[00:32:14.131] they were not
respectful of witnesses.
[00:32:16.266] -And the ridicule that was
piled on these individuals
[00:32:20.070] afterwards is astounding.
[00:32:22.406] -Of this great mass of reports,
[00:32:24.308] we have been able,
adequately, to explain the
[00:32:28.178] great bulk of them.
[00:32:30.114] -But Keyhoe was very
direct in his criticisms of
[00:32:33.517] the Air Force.
[00:32:35.185] -They are simply following
orders to explain away all UFO
[00:32:39.656] sightings as quickly as
possible when they become
[00:32:42.126] public and deny that
UFOs really exist.
[00:32:46.030] -Keyhoe put the absurdity of
the Air Force’s explanations on
[00:32:49.767] display for all to see and
I think by many accounts,
[00:32:52.736] the number of reports actually
started to drop because people
[00:32:56.407] didn’t want to
subject themselves to
[00:32:58.575] the public ridicule.
[00:33:02.046] [Garrett Graff] So Keyhoe
becomes the driving force
[00:33:04.081] behind NICAP, The National
Investigations Committee
[00:33:07.518] on Aerial Phenomena.
[00:33:09.520] Which becomes the
model for civilian
[00:33:13.257] investigation into UFOs.
[00:33:16.760] -Instead of being a subject
for ridicule, and a big joke,
[00:33:21.265] actually it’s a serious
matter which could affect
[00:33:23.734] the lives of all of us.
[00:33:32.576] [Garrett Graff]
NICAP is conducting
[00:33:34.211] its own investigations,
talking to witnesses,
[00:33:36.914] as well as trying
to put pressure on the
[00:33:40.217] government to release
the knowledge that it does
[00:33:43.387] have about the
reality of UFOs.
[00:33:47.658] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
In many cases,
[00:33:48.759] the Air Force didn’t send
anybody to investigate.
[00:33:50.894] They just took in reports
and stamped an explanation
[00:33:53.697] on these incidents.
[00:33:54.966] Whereas Keyhoe and
his organization,
[00:33:56.067] they had investigators
around the country that met,
[00:33:59.803] and analyzed a lot
of these incidents.
[00:34:02.706] It’s an important
counterpoint to the Air Force’s
[00:34:05.776] decades of saying,
“Nothing to see here.”
[00:34:10.781] -I think that Project Blue Book
started off as a sincere effort
[00:34:15.019] to try to get to the bottom
of what this phenomenon was.
[00:34:18.556] But there was a sense in the
general public that there was a
[00:34:21.291] coverup going on that they
were not telling us the truth
[00:34:24.394] about what they
really knew about UFOs.
[00:34:28.298] -In the mid-1960s,
[00:34:30.300] the Air Force decided that
it would be prudent to have
[00:34:34.304] an external academic review
of UFOs and the UFO cases.
[00:34:40.410] And so in the mid-1960s,
[00:34:41.845] the Condon Committee
was formed.
[00:34:45.749] -Dr. Condon, do you hope to
find people from outer space
[00:34:49.319] here on earth?
[00:34:50.988] -Well I don’t know for sure
but we’ll try to just study the
[00:34:53.924] reports and get as much
additional information as we
[00:34:56.727] can to see.
[00:34:59.030] -Dr. Edward Condon
was a physicist who had
[00:35:03.467] a track record that
was quite respectable.
[00:35:07.271] [Marik Von Rennenkampff] In
the years and months before
[00:35:09.706] the final report came out,
[00:35:11.341] Condon was on record
belittling the topic.
[00:35:14.545] -Before the study even began,
[00:35:16.246] he said in a speech
that the government should
[00:35:17.948] get out of the UFO business,
there’s nothing to it.
[00:35:20.951] He later wrote the
authors of UFO books
[00:35:23.420] should be horsewhipped.
[00:35:25.189] [Leslie Kean] Condon is
actually on the record saying
[00:35:27.491] that he didn’t think the
Air Force should have anything
[00:35:29.526] to do with UFOs, but, he said,
[00:35:31.962] “I’m not supposed to make that
conclusion for another year.”
[00:35:36.266] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
One of his staff members wrote
[00:35:37.601] a memo that says,
[00:35:39.269] the trick is to make
this thing appear objective.
[00:35:44.775] And when the report
actually came out,
[00:35:47.344] Condon wrote the
top-level conclusion.
[00:35:49.647] [Leslie Kean] He wrote a
summary of his own report,
[00:35:52.716] which basically said there’s
nothing to any of it,
[00:35:55.119] it’s not worthy of
scientific investigation.
[00:35:58.956] Whereas if you read the report,
[00:36:00.624] there are many cases inside
of it that were not explained
[00:36:04.595] and were stated as
such in the report.
[00:36:07.498] -There are contradictions
in this report.
[00:36:09.700] They state in the
beginning that all the
[00:36:11.735] evidence is negative,
[00:36:13.370] there is no evidence
indicating any reality of
[00:36:15.973] UFOs as devices
under intelligent control.
[00:36:20.077] However, in the report itself,
you will find numerous cases
[00:36:23.880] which say that these,
apparently the object in there
[00:36:26.950] was real and it looks as
though it could be a UFO.
[00:36:32.522] [Linda Powell] Keyhoe
went all out to try and
[00:36:34.524] discredit the report.
[00:36:36.627] And he undermined
confidence in it,
[00:36:39.029] but not sufficient
to overturn it.
[00:36:44.968] -The government in 1969 closed
its official investigation
[00:36:48.639] of UFOs with
Project Blue Book and said,
[00:36:50.874] “There’s no alien craft,
you know, in the atmosphere,
[00:36:54.311] end of story.”
[00:36:57.514] [Leslie Kean] In
1969, Keyhoe retired,
[00:37:00.317] and NICAP was really never
the same without his leadership.
[00:37:04.521] -As for Major
Donald Keyhoe himself,
[00:37:06.523] like most of us, he’s
never seen a flying saucer.
[00:37:09.293] Which may just make
him like a mystic who’s
[00:37:12.429] never seen a ghost.
[00:37:14.264] But one must give him credit.
[00:37:16.300] He has much faith.
[00:37:20.370] [Linda Powell] Keyhoe was
always pushing at the door to
[00:37:23.841] try and get disclosure.
[00:37:26.343] He was permanently optimistic
it was going to come.
[00:37:29.613] He never changed.
[00:37:32.516] I think his role is
historically important.
[00:37:35.586] It shows us how history
has repeated itself.
[00:37:40.657] [Garrett Graff] In many ways
this feels like the same cycle.
[00:37:44.327] Every 20 years the
government comes out with
[00:37:47.664] a new report saying,
[00:37:49.333] “We’re definitely sure
that UFOs aren’t aliens.”
[00:37:53.370] As far as I’m concerned,
[00:37:54.638] the government is
not engaged in some
[00:37:56.506] large-scale cover-up
of alien spacecraft
[00:37:59.676] and alien bodies.
[00:38:01.345] But it does cover up
some chunk of the truth about
[00:38:04.548] UFOs because the
government doesn’t want to
[00:38:07.551] talk about its own
secret research and
[00:38:10.020] development projects or
advanced adversary technology.
[00:38:14.692] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
But the U.S. government will
[00:38:16.626] now need to reckon with
some very serious politicians,
[00:38:19.463] including Senate
majority leader Chuck Schumer,
[00:38:23.400] and the UAP Disclosure Act.
[00:38:26.837] This is a very serious, very
cautious politician proposing
[00:38:30.273] some of the most extraordinary
legislation about UFOs that has
[00:38:33.510] perhaps ever been seen in
the United States Congress.
[00:38:41.785] -Is there anything else you
think that we can do with the
[00:38:43.787] government to
encourage and facilitate
[00:38:45.722] more civilian reporting?
[00:38:47.424] -I think we’re
doing it right now.
[00:38:49.092] -Okay, great.
[00:38:50.327] -I think this hearing is going
to show the American people
[00:38:51.428] that their government
takes this topic seriously.
[00:38:55.032] [Christopher Mellon] It’s
easy in theory to say, well,
[00:38:57.968] of course, you know,
transparency.
[00:38:59.603] We should put
everything out there.
[00:39:01.138] And I lean that way myself,
but I don’t think we should
[00:39:05.041] blithely assume that
it’s an easy call.
[00:39:09.713] If you’re the President
of the United States,
[00:39:13.517] why do you want to terrify
the American public,
[00:39:16.820] the world public,
with this information,
[00:39:20.124] when we can’t do
anything about it?
[00:39:22.292] The markets are
gonna be rattled,
[00:39:24.127] and your entire political
agenda is probably
[00:39:26.897] gonna be overtaken.
[00:39:28.799] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
So with UFOs,
[00:39:30.600] it’s not surprising that there
is some level of secrecy.
[00:39:34.538] But in July of 2023,
[00:39:36.907] in a move that
nobody really saw coming,
[00:39:40.844] Senator Chuck Schumer,
[00:39:41.979] along with Senator Mike Rounds
and a bipartisan group
[00:39:45.582] of four other senators,
[00:39:47.451] announced the
UAP Disclosure Act.
[00:39:52.989] [reporter] Schumer is backing
legislation that would create a
[00:39:55.459] commission with broad authority
to declassify documents
[00:39:58.762] about Unidentified
Aerial Phenomenon.
[00:40:01.998] -For a number of years,
[00:40:03.166] members of the Senate have
questioned whether or not we
[00:40:05.569] were getting all the
facts surrounding what was
[00:40:07.838] actually going on with
unidentified flying objects.
[00:40:11.074] Senator Schumer and I had
decided that what we really
[00:40:13.743] wanted to do was two things.
[00:40:14.878] Number one, provide a
central collection facility or
[00:40:17.981] location with the
National Archives.
[00:40:20.684] And then second,
[00:40:21.785] we wanted a
board of esteemed,
[00:40:24.087] capable individuals that
would actually look through
[00:40:26.122] a lot of this material
and decide what could be
[00:40:28.625] released to the
public and what should,
[00:40:30.227] for national security purposes,
be kept private.
[00:40:34.197] -The United States government
has gathered a great deal of
[00:40:36.900] information about UAPs
over many decades but has
[00:40:40.237] refused to share it
with the American people.
[00:40:42.873] That is wrong,
and additionally,
[00:40:45.108] it breeds mistrust.
[00:40:46.877] -By allowing for an outside,
[00:40:48.645] independent
collection of these records,
[00:40:50.914] we can make progress
in terms of dispelling myths
[00:40:54.050] and providing
accurate information to
[00:40:56.186] the American people.
[00:40:58.155] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
Perhaps most shockingly,
[00:41:00.123] the legislation made references
to non-human intelligence.
[00:41:04.060] -Non-human intelligence.
[00:41:06.162] That is what the actual
text of that amendment says.
[00:41:09.633] -We’ve gone from a point
in which this entire topic
[00:41:13.203] was not taken seriously
by the government.
[00:41:15.939] And now Congress is
talking about the possibility
[00:41:19.576] of aliens in legislation.
[00:41:22.045] [Leslie Kean] Non-human
intelligence was cited in the
[00:41:24.948] legislation at least
18 times or more.
[00:41:29.953] -What’s impressive to me
is that it appeared at all.
[00:41:34.257] -We knew that the
question was gonna be,
[00:41:36.092] “Do you have knowledge of
non-human intelligence?”
[00:41:39.262] We haven’t seen that,
[00:41:41.097] but at least we tried
to put it into statute to say
[00:41:43.900] we want to get that
reported in the future.
[00:41:47.938] -The truth may be out there.
[00:41:49.806] But you won’t find it in
the annual defense bill.
[00:41:52.575] The intelligence community
nixed provisions to declassify
[00:41:55.312] what the government
knows about the unknown.
[00:41:58.348] -100%. They just gutted it.
The gloves are off, man.
[00:42:02.852] -Unfortunately, we didn’t
get the whole bill through.
[00:42:04.754] We did get it out
of the Senate,
[00:42:06.122] but the House had a
different point of view.
[00:42:07.824] They were more concerned
about the disclosure of items
[00:42:11.061] that might be sensitive
to national security.
[00:42:13.797] And they didn’t want to
make a big deal about UAPs.
[00:42:16.866] -You had a very strong
amendment for government
[00:42:18.935] transparency on this issue.
[00:42:20.704] Whether you believe
my allegations or not,
[00:42:24.007] this is a government
transparency issue at large.
[00:42:28.111] I mean, total failure.
[00:42:29.646] It’s one of the biggest
failures, probably,
[00:42:31.114] in the history of Congress.
[00:42:33.216] [Marik Von Rennenkampff]
Despite the House gutting some
[00:42:34.751] of the elements of the
Schumer Disclosure Act,
[00:42:37.220] President Biden signed into
law a very significant element
[00:42:41.124] of that legislation.
[00:42:42.759] -Basically, we got
part of the bill done,
[00:42:44.327] and that was a central
location where material
[00:42:46.830] would be archived,
[00:42:48.332] but we didn’t get
the disclosure board included.
[00:42:51.268] So we’ll continue to
work on the issue.
[00:42:53.403] -We will keep working,
[00:42:54.738] I want to assure
the American people,
[00:42:56.506] Senator Rounds and I
will keep working to change
[00:42:59.342] the status quo.
[00:43:01.511] [Marik Von Rennenkampff] We’ve
seen testimony from pilots,
[00:43:03.980] we’ve seen the videos, we’ve
heard from the witnesses.
[00:43:07.350] We’re seeing, finally,
[00:43:08.952] a true interest in
addressing this mystery,
[00:43:11.755] solving this riddle,
and we should all be intrigued
[00:43:14.958] by the unknown.
[00:43:20.196] -I received a email on
the Navy’s secret network.
[00:43:25.268] “Urgent safety of flight.”
[00:43:27.971] The next day, that email
was wiped from my computer.
[00:43:32.375] -There’s no doubt that
what we saw was the same
[00:43:35.912] type of light formations
that were reported and
[00:43:38.948] well-documented
from the ground.
[00:43:41.351] -I can remember the
apprehension, the helplessness,
[00:43:45.255] abject terror.
[00:43:47.324] -Pilots are scared that if
they come forward individually,
[00:43:50.326] they’re out the door.
[00:43:52.162] But if we all go together,
[00:43:53.730] the door’s not big enough
to get us all through it
[00:43:55.765] at the same time.
[00:43:57.401] Captioned by
Cotter Media Group.