[00:00:00.240] There were four AT bases. [00:00:02.320] >> Yeah. [00:00:02.639] >> Uh I was tasked to do three of them. I [00:00:04.960] never did the one in the Pyrenees. Uh I [00:00:07.440] did the other three. General Stobine, [00:00:09.840] the head of the intelligence and [00:00:11.360] security command, had officers looking [00:00:15.440] for psychic events. And uh a little bit [00:00:18.560] later, General Stobine came out to the [00:00:21.039] field station and they called me into [00:00:23.279] the office and he got right up in my [00:00:25.760] face and scowlled, “Did you kill my [00:00:29.679] computers with your mind?” I was going [00:00:32.160] to lie about it. [00:00:34.239] And I said, “Yes, sir, I did.” If you’ve [00:00:38.079] ever seen the movie The Men Who Stare at [00:00:39.840] Goats, the grin that comes across [00:00:42.079] General Hapgood’s face is exactly the [00:00:44.480] grin that came across General Stubble’s [00:00:47.120] face. And he said, “Far effing out have [00:00:51.280] I ever got a job for you.” I was up at [00:00:54.000] the DIA and headed toward the director’s [00:00:57.039] office and two quote men in black [00:01:01.680] stepped out in the hallway, pointed in. [00:01:04.799] I went in, sat down in front of the [00:01:07.360] interrogator. [00:01:08.880] I I don’t know if I should talk about [00:01:11.119] this or not, but I think I will. [00:01:15.439] Unless you are brand new to the channel, [00:01:17.040] by this point, you are well aware. [00:01:19.600] Between the 1970s and 1990s, the [00:01:22.400] military and intelligence agencies [00:01:24.799] trained psychic spies to pierce the veil [00:01:28.560] of Soviet secrecy and space and time [00:01:32.240] through the practice of remote viewing. [00:01:34.000] But this story gets even more novel, [00:01:35.920] even richer when you start speaking with [00:01:38.640] the individuals involved. Because some [00:01:40.560] of said psychic spies not only peered [00:01:42.560] into enemy bunkers, but places far [00:01:44.960] stranger, far more esoteric, like for [00:01:47.680] instance apparent concealed UFO bases. [00:01:52.159] And some, or at least in the case of [00:01:54.079] Sergeant First Class uh Lynn Buchanan, [00:01:57.040] encountered the notorious men in black. [00:01:59.840] And believe it or not, Lynn’s story goes [00:02:02.880] even further. Beyond remote viewing [00:02:05.119] UFOs, beyond encountering the men in [00:02:07.439] black, all the way up to piloting a UFO [00:02:12.000] himself. [00:02:13.599] Yes, this one goes out there, I guess, [00:02:15.520] even by my standards. But that is what [00:02:18.160] Sergeant First Class Lynn Buchanan says [00:02:21.520] he experienced. Of course, he was a [00:02:23.760] member of the classified Stargate [00:02:25.440] program at Fort me, meaning he is part [00:02:27.599] of a very small fraternity of pioneers [00:02:30.879] in remote viewing. He outlines that [00:02:33.200] story and much more in his fantastic [00:02:34.959] book, The Seventh Sense, which is truly [00:02:37.440] well-ritten and entertaining read that [00:02:39.920] is a must procure for anybody interested [00:02:43.519] in these topics. And speaking of these [00:02:45.360] topics, let’s get into them. But first, [00:02:48.400] uh, do me a small favor. dedicate just a [00:02:51.280] a tiny drip of your personal panuma to [00:02:55.280] tickling the algorithm. Like, subscribe, [00:02:58.720] comment, share, whatever it is you can [00:03:00.640] do on whatever platform you are [00:03:02.959] listening on. I would truly truly [00:03:04.959] appreciate it. Quick update on the [00:03:06.959] YouTube membersonly section and [00:03:08.959] patreon.com/therrops. [00:03:12.400] I actually just uploaded a conversation [00:03:14.959] I had with another member of the Project [00:03:17.519] Stargate fraternity, our beloved Paul [00:03:20.640] Smith. More membersonly/patron [00:03:23.599] content is in the queue. So, now is a [00:03:25.680] lovely time to initiate yourself. And [00:03:27.840] speaking of initiations, uh, let us [00:03:30.239] initiate this mind melt. Lynn Buchanan, [00:03:33.360] it’s really an honor, my friend. I’m so [00:03:35.360] excited to sit down with you to rap with [00:03:37.519] you today. Um, like I was just telling [00:03:39.360] you before we started recording, um, you [00:03:42.000] know, I was aware of you, you know, if [00:03:43.360] you if you dig back into the history of [00:03:45.680] Stargate remote viewing and the whole [00:03:48.080] era at Fort me, you’re going to see the [00:03:50.000] name Lin Buchanan. You’re going to come [00:03:51.440] across your book. So, I was I was [00:03:53.440] familiar with you. But then, um, our [00:03:55.360] mutual friend Adam Curry spoke of you [00:03:58.080] specifically as somebody who was really [00:04:00.400] influential and impressive to him early [00:04:02.959] on in his own explorations into SAI. So [00:04:05.760] immediately I was like, “Please connect [00:04:07.120] me with Lynn because I I would love to [00:04:08.879] talk to that man.” So so so excited, [00:04:11.040] man. [00:04:11.599] >> Yeah. I don’t uh I don’t advertise a lot [00:04:14.799] or get out and toot my horn or anything [00:04:16.720] and so uh people hear about the other [00:04:20.239] people, but uh you know, my name just [00:04:23.600] sort of falls in the background and [00:04:25.040] that’s fine for me. Um what I want is to [00:04:29.600] get a bunch of good remote viewers [00:04:31.360] going. [00:04:33.040] um and get them famous for what they do. [00:04:38.080] >> I’ve already I’ve already done my stuff. [00:04:41.120] >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I I would love to [00:04:42.960] talk to you about the legacy of remote [00:04:45.840] viewing and and how you feel about the [00:04:48.080] state of things with remote viewing at [00:04:50.080] some point in the conversation, but you [00:04:52.479] do have a really fun origin story, my [00:04:55.360] friend. Like, and just this this early [00:04:58.080] history of yours with strange [00:05:00.240] occurrences, uh, sort of, uh, [00:05:03.360] psychoinetic events, events that could [00:05:06.479] be called, uh, ESP, I guess, broadly [00:05:10.080] related events. So, I would love for you [00:05:12.720] to just kind of tell your origin story. [00:05:16.160] >> Yeah. When I was about 12 years old, I [00:05:18.960] started having PK events. You’ve heard [00:05:21.039] of um uh poltergeist children. [00:05:24.960] >> You know, they get upset and things fall [00:05:27.280] off shelves and all that. Um, that’s [00:05:30.000] actually a lot more common than most [00:05:33.120] people know about. But, uh, when it [00:05:35.520] starts happening, their parents [00:05:37.039] generally find some way to stop it or, [00:05:40.479] uh, nay it and all that and they give it [00:05:43.600] up. [00:05:45.120] My mother uh, actually encouraged it. [00:05:49.919] And um so I am the kind of person who [00:05:56.800] databases I get curious about everything [00:05:59.039] and all that. So when it first started [00:06:01.360] happening I started taking notes and [00:06:04.000] keeping documents and trying all these [00:06:06.639] different things and working it out and [00:06:09.360] uh seeing if I could hone it and perfect [00:06:11.759] it, get it working better. And it [00:06:14.960] happened and u I got pretty good at it. [00:06:18.720] And then um one day [00:06:23.360] my life is a lot like Charlie Brown’s. [00:06:26.160] There was the cute little redheaded [00:06:27.600] girl, you know, [00:06:29.759] and uh and so I was showing off to her [00:06:33.840] and she was very impressed and went home [00:06:36.720] and told her father, the Pentecostal [00:06:38.800] prior preacher. [00:06:41.120] And the next day I was walking home from [00:06:43.280] school and he and three of his deacons [00:06:48.240] met me on the sidewalk and he said, you [00:06:50.639] know, just friendly as he could be, I I [00:06:53.199] hear you can do these tricks and I would [00:06:55.199] like really like to see one and all [00:06:56.800] that. And so I said, okay, you know, and [00:06:59.599] showed him one. And uh [00:07:03.120] immediately he and the deacons had me [00:07:06.400] just throwing me down on the sidewalk [00:07:08.400] and pressing my head into the sidewalk, [00:07:11.120] screaming for Satan to come out of me [00:07:13.520] and all this other stuff. Scared me half [00:07:16.080] to death. And um and that made me start [00:07:22.000] hiding it. [00:07:23.039] >> Yeah. And I’ve hidden it almost all my [00:07:26.880] life, but uh at certain times it comes [00:07:29.759] out and uh you know when I get angry, so [00:07:35.199] I usually just laugh things off. I don’t [00:07:38.240] I try to never get angry. [00:07:42.400] Does that still happen or is it is it [00:07:44.319] something that you’ve kind of learned to [00:07:45.840] how to continue? [00:07:46.639] >> No, it’s it still happens at times when [00:07:49.120] when I get, you know, um angry or [00:07:53.039] something like that. Yeah. [00:07:54.720] >> Wow. Wow. And then I mean, stop me if [00:07:58.639] there are stories in the interim that [00:08:00.080] you you do want to share, but one of [00:08:02.080] these events happens to you while you’re [00:08:04.879] in the military and then this sort of [00:08:07.120] like changes the trajectory of your [00:08:09.599] life, right? Oh, it did. Yeah. Um I had [00:08:13.840] been uh selected. There were two of us [00:08:18.479] uh programmers who were um vying for the [00:08:22.879] position to write a program that would [00:08:26.000] tie the intelligence [00:08:28.160] computers of 12 different military [00:08:31.440] countries uh countries militaries um [00:08:35.599] together to share intelligence [00:08:37.919] information. [00:08:39.760] And uh I got the um I got the job. [00:08:45.600] Uh took me like six or seven months to [00:08:49.760] write the program. And the day came when [00:08:52.720] I was um to show the program to all the [00:08:56.560] commanding generals of the 12 different [00:08:58.399] countries. And um and um I set [00:09:03.360] everything up and got it ready. I went [00:09:06.640] to the bathroom to make sure my hair was [00:09:09.040] perfectly combed and there were no [00:09:10.880] wrinkles in my uniform and everything [00:09:12.800] else. I came back and did my little song [00:09:16.320] and dance to introduce the program and [00:09:18.880] all. turned around and hit the enter key [00:09:22.080] and the computer went dead [00:09:25.440] and uh everybody started laughing at me [00:09:29.600] and uh I turned around and this other [00:09:32.320] sergeant was at the back door of the [00:09:34.480] room said gotcha and turned around [00:09:38.320] walked off. I got flaming mad and when I [00:09:41.600] did the uh basically the field station [00:09:47.120] went dead and uh I knew what I had done [00:09:53.040] but also knew that we could blame it on [00:09:56.160] him for you know for putting whatever he [00:09:59.680] did in. But um [00:10:02.480] >> anyway um General Stubbleine, the head [00:10:05.360] of the intelligence and security command [00:10:08.560] had officers looking for PK and psychic [00:10:13.440] events. [00:10:14.320] >> Yeah. [00:10:14.959] >> And one of them happened to be just [00:10:17.839] stepped into the room. He said he just [00:10:20.160] wanted to see 12 generals in a room at [00:10:22.240] one time, you know, and just out of [00:10:24.720] curiosity, he saw it. He recognized what [00:10:28.079] happened. [00:10:29.760] And uh a little bit later, General [00:10:32.399] Stobine came out to the field station to [00:10:34.720] install a new commander there. And they [00:10:37.680] called me into the office and he got [00:10:40.640] right up in my face and scowlled, “Did [00:10:45.839] you kill my computers with your mind?” [00:10:48.880] And u I heard one estimate that it was [00:10:51.760] like $50 million worth of computers. [00:10:54.240] >> Wow. [00:10:54.720] >> And um [00:10:56.959] um I don’t know if it’s that high. It [00:10:58.959] seems high to me, but that’s the [00:11:00.240] estimate I heard. But um [00:11:03.920] I was going to lie about it. [00:11:06.560] And I said, “Yes, sir, I did.” [00:11:11.680] If you’ve ever seen the movie The Men [00:11:13.360] Who Stare at Goats, where General Hapg [00:11:16.000] Good asks Len Cassidy that question and [00:11:20.000] he says, “Yes, the grin that comes [00:11:22.880] across [00:11:24.480] General Hapgood’s face is exactly the [00:11:26.959] grin that came across General Stubble’s [00:11:29.600] face.” And he said, “Far effing out have [00:11:33.760] I ever got a job for you.” And he pulled [00:11:37.040] me out of there, took me to DC. [00:11:41.040] He wanted to um start a unit that would [00:11:46.240] destroy enemy computers mentally [00:11:49.680] um with the end goal of learning how to [00:11:53.920] control enemy computers. [00:11:56.480] >> Wow. make their missiles either turn [00:11:58.560] around and go back or drop into the sea [00:12:00.399] or whatever and destroy the u data that [00:12:04.959] was in enemy computers or scrub, you [00:12:08.639] know, scramble it up or whatever. And um [00:12:12.639] Congress got caught in the 60s doing [00:12:14.880] mind control experiments on US citizens. [00:12:18.079] >> Yeah. MKL, right? Yeah. [00:12:20.000] >> They got burned badly for it. And uh so [00:12:24.079] Congress said, “No, that sounds like [00:12:27.279] mind control. We won’t fund it.” So they [00:12:31.279] took me out uh General Stabbine took me [00:12:33.600] out to Fort me where they had this unit [00:12:36.320] in this ramshackled old rundown building [00:12:41.200] and um he introduced me and said, “I’m [00:12:45.760] putting him here.” and uh they read me [00:12:48.639] on. [00:12:50.560] And reading you on is where they hand [00:12:53.600] you a sheet of paper that you read that [00:12:56.399] tells what the unit really does, not [00:13:00.079] what they tell the public they do. [00:13:02.000] >> Yeah. [00:13:02.560] >> And um and so um I read that, signed it, [00:13:08.560] you know, 10 years in jail, in prison, [00:13:12.320] and whatever if you reveal what’s on [00:13:14.880] this page. [00:13:15.760] >> Wow. And um [00:13:18.880] I thought [00:13:21.200] the military doesn’t use psychics. [00:13:23.760] That’s crazy. You know, I thought this [00:13:25.680] is some kind of a trick or something. [00:13:27.600] But over the next couple of weeks, I [00:13:29.360] watched the guys working there and they [00:13:31.839] were doing it and it was [00:13:34.720] it was working. [00:13:36.800] And uh so I thought, well, no wonder [00:13:41.839] it’s classified, [00:13:43.200] >> right? But uh I said, “Hey, I’m for [00:13:47.279] this. Teach me.” [00:13:48.880] >> Amazing. [00:13:49.440] >> And yeah, [00:13:50.320] >> they did. [00:13:52.000] >> So So ju just so just to summarize for [00:13:54.399] the audience, you’re you’re working a [00:13:57.680] you know like a computer science sort of [00:14:00.560] post. It was it in Germany? [00:14:03.839] >> It was in Germany. Yeah. Als Germany. [00:14:06.079] Yeah. [00:14:06.480] >> Yeah. And you have this professional [00:14:07.920] rivalry with this other guy who has your [00:14:10.079] job who’s also a programmer and he [00:14:13.040] sabotages you basically and you know [00:14:16.160] that he sabotages you which which makes [00:14:18.240] you livid [00:14:19.839] >> starts off this this um this PK event [00:14:22.320] that takes down all these computers. [00:14:24.720] Stubbleine who’s into all of this [00:14:28.240] esoteric psychic stuff hears about it is [00:14:31.199] like I want to see if this guy’s really [00:14:33.440] psychic. [00:14:34.560] >> Yeah. recruits you and boom, now [00:14:37.600] suddenly you’re at Fort me on this on [00:14:40.160] this remote viewing team like [00:14:42.079] >> Yeah. Stouble stubble by sent me to the [00:14:44.480] Monroe in He sent me to the Monroe [00:14:46.560] Institute first. Yeah. [00:14:48.560] >> Yeah. I want to talk to you about that, [00:14:49.839] too. I I actually did a gateway retreat [00:14:52.320] um at the end of last year. So, I had a [00:14:55.839] I won’t get into my experience yet, but [00:14:57.920] um I wanted to ask about Stubble because [00:15:00.880] I I’ve read, you know, I’ve read um a [00:15:03.120] couple books on this whole era. I’ve [00:15:04.800] read uh phenomena. I’ve read your book. [00:15:07.360] Um but one of the things I’m foggy on is [00:15:10.079] um how did he become interested in like [00:15:14.160] the esoteric and and sigh? Do you is [00:15:17.040] that known? [00:15:19.360] >> I’m not really sure how he became [00:15:21.519] interested in it. Uh, I know that he was [00:15:24.320] um a Scientologist. [00:15:27.279] >> Oh, was he? Okay. [00:15:28.160] >> Previously a Scientologist. [00:15:30.800] And um so it may have come from that. Um [00:15:34.240] >> very interesting. [00:15:34.880] >> I know. Um [00:15:36.880] >> um most of the [00:15:39.760] people forming the controlled remote [00:15:42.800] viewing protocols and all that were all [00:15:44.959] Scientologist, Joe. [00:15:46.160] >> Right. Right. And then that eventually [00:15:48.959] leads to this controversy where, you [00:15:51.199] know, we’re getting into the lore a [00:15:52.480] little bit now, but you know, like these [00:15:53.839] early figures like Hal Putoff, Russell [00:15:55.759] Tar, Pat Price, there was this early [00:15:58.160] involvement with Scientology. And some [00:16:01.680] people believe that um that Pat Price, [00:16:04.639] who’s widely regarded as potentially [00:16:07.199] like the greatest remote viewer or early [00:16:09.920] remote viewer, it’s like between him and [00:16:11.360] Ingo Swan, um he eventually [00:16:13.360] >> he wasn’t a remote viewer. He was a he [00:16:15.279] was a psychic. Yeah. [00:16:16.480] >> Yeah. fantastic psychic. Yeah. [00:16:19.279] >> But he dies under mysterious [00:16:22.000] circumstances and you know every [00:16:24.320] everybody knows that it was kind of like [00:16:26.480] you know he was working directly for the [00:16:28.320] CIA at this point. He was taken out of [00:16:30.320] the Stargate project. So people you know [00:16:33.600] don’t know if it was the CIA, the [00:16:36.000] Russians, the Scientologists. There’s [00:16:38.079] like this big interesting web of of [00:16:41.120] intrigue going on in the early days. [00:16:43.360] >> Yeah. [00:16:44.959] H [00:16:45.199] >> how do you think it was? I mean I I mean [00:16:47.839] this is speculation obviously or maybe [00:16:49.839] you know I’m sure you know more than I [00:16:51.600] do but h how do you think that those [00:16:53.600] wires crossed like early scientology and [00:16:57.199] all this s stuff? [00:16:59.279] >> I’m not sure because by the time uh the [00:17:04.720] control remote viewing was going uh all [00:17:08.000] of them had left Scientology [00:17:10.000] >> right [00:17:11.199] >> and they successfully left Scientology [00:17:13.760] which is hard to do. Yeah. H how do you [00:17:16.799] think they were able to do that without [00:17:18.319] without too much trouble? [00:17:20.000] >> Uh I think they had official enough [00:17:24.079] titles and situations where they had the [00:17:28.480] clout enough to say [00:17:29.840] >> Yeah. [00:17:30.799] >> screw off, you know? [00:17:32.000] >> Right. Yeah. Yeah. Hell Pututoff [00:17:34.000] probably had he’s probably got multiple [00:17:36.559] ways to be like, “Hey, don’t [ __ ] with [00:17:37.840] me.” Okay. Like Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [00:17:41.200] Yeah. [00:17:44.240] >> Um Yeah. So, so here you are now and and [00:17:46.960] I’m this is one of the things I’m always [00:17:48.480] really intrigued by too is this, you [00:17:51.440] know, I I remember Paul Smith saying [00:17:53.280] something like, you know, he had been [00:17:54.640] read on to top secret compartmentalized [00:17:56.799] stuff before. Reading on to this program [00:17:59.280] was like another level of insanely [00:18:02.160] strict, insanely secret. Um, what what [00:18:06.240] were those early days for you like? And [00:18:09.440] how what is the orientation they put you [00:18:12.080] through like? [00:18:14.400] Um, Angus one lost his contract with the [00:18:19.200] government [00:18:21.679] two days before I got there. [00:18:23.600] >> Yeah. [00:18:24.000] >> Story of my life. Yeah. [00:18:26.720] And so, um, he had trained, uh, the, um, [00:18:32.480] I think it was at five other viewers who [00:18:35.200] were there at the time. And, um, [00:18:40.160] um, so they said, “Well, we’ll teach [00:18:42.320] you.” Well, come to find out later, [00:18:46.000] Angus Swan had been changing the [00:18:48.080] technology. He never got it fully [00:18:49.760] developed. And so, as he taught each [00:18:52.960] student, they were getting a different [00:18:56.880] meth, you know, a different version of [00:18:58.960] the methodology. And so, there was [00:19:01.760] learning all the different versions of [00:19:03.600] of the methodology with [00:19:07.600] teacher one day contradicting the other [00:19:09.440] one the other day and all that. So I [00:19:12.080] wound up uh melding it all together and [00:19:16.240] forming my own and then um later uh got [00:19:21.039] to be good close friends with Ingo and [00:19:23.919] still got personal [00:19:26.480] non-official but personal [00:19:29.520] um training and discussion and deeper [00:19:32.640] understandings than uh uh he gave to the [00:19:36.799] military. Um, [00:19:39.360] >> Eningo [00:19:40.880] basically taught the military by wrote [00:19:43.679] memorization of a protocol [00:19:46.799] and we would get together and have [00:19:48.640] coffee and do stuff and all that and he [00:19:51.600] would say, “Well, here’s why that [00:19:53.600] happened and here’s how it happens and [00:19:55.919] and would go into the depth of it.” And [00:19:58.720] so um I had already learned the protocol [00:20:02.960] and uh I got the reasons behind it and [00:20:06.799] all that. And these days that’s what I [00:20:09.200] teach. I teach for understanding rather [00:20:11.600] than just teaching the protocol. M [00:20:13.840] >> but um [00:20:16.480] um [00:20:18.960] the [00:20:20.960] I don’t know the um first days of it um [00:20:26.640] I know I didn’t believe it. Okay. [00:20:31.120] And so I guess about on the third or [00:20:34.640] fourth day they said okay we’re going to [00:20:37.440] do what’s called a beacon exercise. [00:20:40.000] We’re going to send two of the viewers [00:20:42.320] out to some place that we don’t know [00:20:44.320] where they are. And you can’t bleed us [00:20:47.440] for information at all. And so they [00:20:50.640] picked they randomly picked a sealed [00:20:52.720] envelope out of a bunch of envelopes. [00:20:55.919] Drove away. And after they got totally [00:21:00.320] away from the unit, they opened the [00:21:02.240] envelope to see where to go. and it [00:21:05.120] wound up being a um a playground park [00:21:09.679] somewhere in the area there. And so they [00:21:13.600] said, “Okay.” [00:21:15.280] Uh 15 minutes later, they said, “Okay, [00:21:18.640] they are by they are at the site by now. [00:21:21.520] We want you to describe the site where [00:21:24.240] they are.” And I said, “Well, how do [00:21:27.919] they do that?” And they said, “Well, [00:21:29.120] just write whatever comes to mind.” [00:21:32.159] And what came to mind over the next 20 [00:21:35.280] minutes was two people just driving [00:21:38.960] around looking out windows [00:21:41.440] not knowing where they are and they were [00:21:43.039] confused and that’s all I got. I was [00:21:45.840] expecting [00:21:47.919] a sight. They were expecting me to get a [00:21:50.400] sight and all that. And uh so anyway the [00:21:54.559] um the monitor said, “Okay, well you [00:21:57.440] didn’t you didn’t do it and uh don’t [00:22:00.080] worry. It’s your first time. don’t worry [00:22:02.159] about it and all that. [00:22:04.000] >> And um we’ll find out where they went [00:22:06.640] when they come back. Well, they came [00:22:09.039] back later and they said, “We never [00:22:12.000] could find the place. We just drove and [00:22:14.240] drove and drove.” [00:22:16.400] And all of a sudden, I realized, “Hey, [00:22:19.679] maybe I can do this, too.” [00:22:22.559] You know, [00:22:24.400] >> it’s it’s funny how Paul has a similar [00:22:26.960] story about the doughnut shop, which I’m [00:22:28.559] sure you’ve heard where his target was [00:22:30.799] the water tower and he saw the doughut [00:22:32.720] shop that they stopped by instead. Yeah, [00:22:35.440] it’s [00:22:35.840] >> that’s happened that’s happened to me [00:22:37.280] several times, too, when they said, [00:22:39.280] “Okay, well, you got the target. Let’s [00:22:41.039] stop by this other and [00:22:43.840] that stopping by the other place [00:22:46.960] influenced the session you’ve already [00:22:48.720] done.” Yeah. And in some ways this [00:22:51.200] really underscores some of the the [00:22:53.760] difficulties, you know, if people have [00:22:55.679] already accepted in their mind, okay, [00:22:58.159] remote viewing seems to be real. I I’ve [00:23:00.400] heard enough stories. I’ve seen enough, [00:23:02.400] you know, data. Maybe I’ve experienced [00:23:04.799] similar things myself. It it really [00:23:07.200] underscores the intricacies of remote [00:23:10.159] viewing and how difficult it can be to [00:23:13.360] get to the desired target instead of all [00:23:16.640] of the other noise and things that [00:23:18.400] happen around the target, prior to the [00:23:20.240] target, adjacent to the target. So yeah, [00:23:22.720] it’s it’s that that’s really fascinating [00:23:25.360] stuff. [00:23:26.400] >> So was there anything else in the in the [00:23:29.039] sort of like initiation period? Is there [00:23:31.440] like material they make you review, [00:23:33.760] books they make you read, stuff like [00:23:36.559] that? [00:23:37.520] >> Not books. Um, there’s a thing called an [00:23:40.400] edagram. [00:23:41.600] >> Yeah. [00:23:41.919] >> Uh, the subconscious mind doesn’t speak [00:23:45.120] to the conscious mind, but it speaks to [00:23:47.280] the body. And so, just like in martial [00:23:50.159] arts, wax on, wipe off, wax on, wipe [00:23:52.559] off, and all that. And um so they will [00:23:56.880] sit there and at the time we didn’t have [00:24:00.000] computers there. Okay. So, uh, one of [00:24:04.400] them would sit there and say water and I [00:24:07.919] would draw a wavy line and they would [00:24:10.320] say man-made and I would draw something [00:24:12.960] with an angle and and they would say [00:24:15.760] structure and uh I would uh draw a [00:24:20.320] circle for space and things like that [00:24:24.240] and would sit there for [00:24:26.960] what seemed like hours just doing that. [00:24:30.960] and the wax on, wipe off, just like in [00:24:33.679] the martial arts, you know, you get so [00:24:35.520] bored that your conscious mind just [00:24:37.919] starts thinking about something else. [00:24:39.760] Pretty soon, your subconscious mind is [00:24:41.760] doing the work. [00:24:43.120] >> Mhm. [00:24:43.840] >> And uh at some point along the way, it [00:24:48.400] will do the idoggram before the guy [00:24:50.880] calls the word. [00:24:52.960] And uh so we did that for just [00:25:00.080] excruciating amounts of time. [00:25:03.600] And um that’s your first initiation to [00:25:06.640] get your body trained to tell you what [00:25:09.360] the subconscious knows. [00:25:10.960] >> Yeah. [00:25:11.679] >> And uh then one day they say, “Okay, we [00:25:14.640] have a picture in an envelope. Um [00:25:18.880] what’s in it?” “Well, I don’t know.” [00:25:21.760] Okay. Well, this is envelope number 25. [00:25:26.000] And your hand goes like this. And you [00:25:27.679] say, “I don’t know what’s in it, but [00:25:29.760] there’s water and some kind of a [00:25:33.520] structure.” [00:25:35.360] And they open the envelope and there’s a [00:25:37.200] boat sitting on the ocean. [00:25:38.799] >> Yeah. [00:25:39.919] >> And uh your subconscious has told you [00:25:43.039] through your body what the what the [00:25:46.159] target is. And um then after you get [00:25:50.080] good at that [00:25:52.080] which takes practice, practice, practice [00:25:54.960] um then they will say okay [00:25:58.960] like in that case there they will say [00:26:00.960] okay describe the water. [00:26:05.440] Well it’s water. No don’t use nouns. [00:26:08.640] Describe it. Taste it. Oh tastes salty. [00:26:13.760] You know still haven’t looked at the [00:26:15.279] feedback. Um, tastes salty and it’s What [00:26:18.799] temperature is it? It’s cold. Um Um, [00:26:23.120] stick your hand into it. Oh, it’s wet. [00:26:25.919] Uh, [00:26:27.520] look at it. Oh, it’s it’s wavy. It’s not [00:26:32.159] smooth and all this and it’s big. And [00:26:35.440] you start describing and describing. [00:26:37.919] Okay, now that you’ve done that, let’s [00:26:40.159] describe the structure that you saw. [00:26:44.400] Well, it’s it’s sticking up out of the [00:26:47.279] water. It’s pointed on one end. It’s [00:26:49.760] tall. It’s, you know, and you start [00:26:52.480] describing. And um this is stage two [00:26:56.880] where you take the information you got [00:26:59.440] from stage one and start describing it [00:27:02.000] in an organized manner. [00:27:04.159] >> Mhm. [00:27:05.120] >> Then uh you go into stage three after [00:27:08.080] you’ve learned to do that. Well, you go [00:27:11.039] into stage three where you say, “Oh, [00:27:13.360] it’s pointed on one end and and big.” [00:27:16.480] Well, can you sketch that? And you start [00:27:19.440] sketching it. And then you go into stage [00:27:22.000] four, five, six, seven, and all that as [00:27:24.799] you as you train. And um in the end, um [00:27:31.679] you know, they tell me what’s in the [00:27:33.679] document that’s locked in the safe in [00:27:36.240] the Kremlin, you know. Yeah. [00:27:38.960] >> Okay. [00:27:40.000] Um, there’s a there’s a house. I’m not [00:27:43.279] going to tell you where. Draw the floor [00:27:45.120] plans. Oh, okay. Yeah, I can do that. [00:27:49.360] Yeah. [00:27:49.919] >> So, when when then do they do they just [00:27:52.400] kind of surprise you one day when they [00:27:54.080] start to actually task you or do you [00:27:55.919] know ahead of time, okay, I’m going to [00:27:57.279] get my first real tasking today or how [00:27:59.279] does that go? [00:28:00.640] >> The big surprise was uh [00:28:04.159] Eningga always gave in session feedback. [00:28:07.600] So if you did something right, he’d say [00:28:09.520] correct. Okay? And if you did something [00:28:13.919] wrong, he wouldn’t say anything. No [00:28:16.159] reward. No negative rewards. The silence [00:28:20.000] was a negative reward when he didn’t say [00:28:22.559] anything. And uh so at some point they [00:28:27.600] say, “Okay, you’ve got the method, [00:28:29.520] you’ve got the protocols down, you’ve [00:28:31.760] got the training, you’ve got all that. [00:28:34.159] So let’s do another target.” and I’m not [00:28:38.080] giving you any insession feedback. [00:28:41.600] And so you do something and the monitor [00:28:44.559] sits there and stares. What have I done [00:28:47.120] wrong? You know, and so they say, go [00:28:51.279] ahead. And you do your session, they [00:28:55.039] don’t say anything. What have I done [00:28:56.480] wrong? Oh, I’ve messed up. [00:28:59.039] They take the picture out of the [00:29:00.240] envelope and you see that you did it [00:29:02.799] right without the feedback coming in. [00:29:05.840] all that you don’t depend on your [00:29:07.600] monitor. [00:29:09.120] And then you go through that process of [00:29:11.039] learning how to [00:29:13.520] uh view the target in spite of [00:29:18.080] not having any help. [00:29:19.760] >> Yeah. [00:29:20.960] >> And um then along the way you learn to [00:29:25.600] um up to this point you’ve been viewing [00:29:28.399] your feedback. [00:29:30.159] Okay. You’ve been viewing what you’re [00:29:31.919] going to see a few minutes later. So [00:29:33.679] you’ve been viewing through time [00:29:35.440] actually uh you’ve been viewing forward [00:29:38.320] into the immediate future. [00:29:40.320] >> And so at some point they will um they [00:29:43.520] will give you a target [00:29:46.960] uh without feedback [00:29:50.960] and they will give you the score of how [00:29:56.240] you did but you don’t get any feedback [00:29:59.120] ever. And um this is uh a lot of this is [00:30:03.600] in training for the fact that um [00:30:08.799] uh since most people view their feedback [00:30:11.600] while they’re learning. [00:30:12.880] >> Yeah. [00:30:13.919] >> If you work for one of the three-letter [00:30:15.679] agencies and this happened several times [00:30:19.360] and you want your feedback, [00:30:22.000] they’ll come back and say, “Sorry, [00:30:24.000] you’re not cleared for the information [00:30:25.360] you gave us.” [00:30:26.399] >> Wow, that’s crazy. you know, or they [00:30:29.840] will just come back and lie to you. So, [00:30:32.799] if you can only view your feedback [00:30:36.240] and their feedback is a lie, your [00:30:39.120] session is going to be bad. [00:30:41.360] >> So, they teach you to view the target no [00:30:44.240] matter what the feedback. [00:30:46.720] >> Yeah. [00:30:47.279] >> Okay. [00:30:47.679] >> And and for people for people that don’t [00:30:49.360] know, this is a really important point [00:30:51.200] because there are there are people out [00:30:52.880] there who philosophize about how this is [00:30:55.520] possible. Like there’s a um are you [00:30:57.760] familiar with Eric Wargo? He wrote this [00:30:59.360] book Time Loops. [00:31:01.279] >> Um [00:31:01.840] >> I’ve heard of the book. I haven’t read [00:31:03.440] it. Yeah. [00:31:04.240] >> So So his um [00:31:07.200] he believes in sigh. He believes in [00:31:08.880] remote viewing. But his interpretation [00:31:10.960] is that it’s actually the viewer somehow [00:31:15.679] viewing [00:31:17.279] their their future self like f knowledge [00:31:20.159] that their future self has through [00:31:22.720] getting the feedback. and and he really [00:31:24.559] sticks to this idea that in every [00:31:26.559] documented case that’s known, people [00:31:29.039] always get the feedback and that’s [00:31:30.799] actually what they’re remote viewing. [00:31:32.559] And [00:31:33.039] >> yeah, [00:31:33.679] >> he you know, he’s got this like what [00:31:36.320] sounds like a logically solid [00:31:39.039] >> tautology laid out there, right? Like, [00:31:41.120] okay, it makes sense that if you if [00:31:43.279] you’re going to know that you were [00:31:44.399] correct, you’re going to have to [00:31:46.480] >> have gotten the feedback to know you [00:31:47.919] were correct. But hearing what you just [00:31:50.240] said, I feel like that kind of pokes a [00:31:52.159] hole in that argument because clearly [00:31:54.559] you must actually have some kind of um [00:31:57.919] >> it it does poke a hole in it because [00:32:01.360] >> and 99% of the [00:32:04.080] >> people doing remote viewing, that’s [00:32:06.960] exactly what they do. They view their [00:32:08.640] feedback. [00:32:09.600] >> Interesting. They never get to that [00:32:11.279] training, which is some hard training by [00:32:14.240] the way, uh that we got to where you [00:32:18.480] view the target in spite of getting [00:32:21.440] right feedback, wrong feed, feedback, no [00:32:24.320] feedback. M [00:32:25.679] >> um um [00:32:28.480] one of the things they will say is um I [00:32:31.519] know one target we had to introduce this [00:32:35.519] uh they had a picture of a lake that was [00:32:38.399] there on Fort me during the winter [00:32:42.640] frozen over [00:32:45.039] and so they said okay um view this [00:32:48.640] target I got a lake and all that and um [00:32:53.120] and I got a lake with ducks floating [00:32:55.760] around on it and all that. And the view [00:32:59.200] the um the time I did the session was in [00:33:03.200] the middle of the summer and I got the [00:33:06.080] lake in the middle of the summer and [00:33:08.559] then they showed me the feedback that [00:33:11.279] said, you know, this is frozen, [00:33:15.600] but you got the lake in spite of the [00:33:19.279] feedback, [00:33:20.480] >> you describe the lake as it is. M [00:33:23.279] >> and so then they will start doing things [00:33:25.919] like that. Um they’ll give you a [00:33:28.240] coordinate and u and [00:33:32.880] say okay move to the targeted date and [00:33:37.679] the targeted date may be 50 years ago. [00:33:41.440] >> Okay. They don’t tell you what the [00:33:43.279] targeted date is and you describe it and [00:33:47.039] then they show you [00:33:49.440] the feedback of that specific spot at [00:33:53.360] the present time which now has a huge [00:33:57.200] building on it and you’ve just described [00:33:59.360] an empty field [00:34:01.519] >> and yes, you did it right. [00:34:05.679] >> Wow. [00:34:06.080] >> Okay. [00:34:06.480] >> Yeah. [00:34:08.000] >> Yeah. So let let’s take a let’s take a [00:34:10.000] sidebar here into something a bit more [00:34:11.760] philosophical which is you know the [00:34:14.960] theory on how this works because that’s [00:34:17.359] a whole separate question like you prove [00:34:18.879] to yourself you can do it but clearly [00:34:20.879] you’re not using you know any known uh [00:34:24.480] you know you’re it’s not like throw [00:34:26.720] maybe it’s like throwing a football or a [00:34:28.320] martial art in that you’re doing a skill [00:34:30.399] that you must learn but it’s not a [00:34:32.159] physiological skill right it’s it’s [00:34:34.800] something that’s happening within the [00:34:37.359] realm of the mental and you’re you like [00:34:40.159] to use the phrase subconscious. Um, but [00:34:43.520] I’m curious when you say subconscious, [00:34:46.240] do do you mean something similar to like [00:34:48.720] what Carl Jung would have meant when he [00:34:50.879] says subconscious or [00:34:52.399] >> when you said unconscious? He said [00:34:54.079] unconscious. Yeah. [00:34:55.440] >> Right. But yeah, so there’s like the the [00:34:57.280] the unconscious, the collective, and [00:35:00.079] then there’s like the personal [00:35:02.400] unconscious or subconscious. But this is [00:35:05.599] like [00:35:06.720] >> almost everybody has a theory of how it [00:35:08.880] works and where it comes from. And um [00:35:12.000] >> they hang on to that theory [00:35:16.400] like they’re lost at sea and it’s the [00:35:18.480] only thing that floats and they will [00:35:20.640] never let go of it. And even if you [00:35:23.280] rescue them from it, they you get them [00:35:26.560] up into the boat, they still cling on to [00:35:29.040] that theory. They’re not going to let go [00:35:30.640] of it and all that. And u the theory [00:35:35.200] that I have developed over all these [00:35:38.160] years [00:35:39.839] is [00:35:41.599] I don’t know the answer. [00:35:45.599] And so [00:35:49.040] that’s the sum of my theory. I don’t [00:35:51.920] know where it comes from. I don’t know [00:35:53.680] how it works. Uh all I know is that we [00:35:58.320] can bring home missing soldiers. we can [00:36:01.359] help bring home missing kids and all I [00:36:04.160] know is it works. So I sit down and do [00:36:06.720] it and I never worry about how it works. [00:36:10.720] And u you know I have [00:36:14.000] u I have a theory of course that the [00:36:17.839] your un your subconscious mind has [00:36:21.520] access to universal information. [00:36:26.160] I can’t even define what universal [00:36:29.280] information means. So, it’s it’s just a [00:36:32.480] a way to have a little pet theory of my [00:36:35.119] own. But um the um [00:36:40.000] subconscious mind [00:36:42.560] um okay [00:36:45.119] many of the psychiatrists and [00:36:47.359] psychologists I have as students just [00:36:50.400] rail over the fact that I use [00:36:52.079] subconscious instead of Yung and Freud’s [00:36:55.359] um unconscious. [00:36:57.280] >> Sure. [00:36:57.680] >> And I say [00:37:00.640] the unconscious that’s a noun [00:37:03.920] you’re talking about a thing. [00:37:05.359] unconscious. [00:37:08.000] Um, as an adjective, [00:37:12.320] it is not unconscious. [00:37:15.119] It’s very conscious. And they agree with [00:37:18.000] that. And um, I say both you and Freud [00:37:22.160] had microersonalities within the [00:37:24.960] unconscious. [00:37:26.320] >> They agree with that. [00:37:27.599] >> And I say each one of those is [00:37:29.760] conscious. So I call it the [00:37:32.160] subconsciouses, [00:37:35.520] subconscious [00:37:37.520] >> and they still rail against my use of [00:37:40.880] the word subconscious because Y and [00:37:42.560] Freud never said it. But um um that’s [00:37:47.119] why I call it the sub the [00:37:48.880] subconsciousness. [00:37:52.079] It’s below the lemon. Uh [00:37:56.480] uh [00:37:59.440] do you know what the sub do you know [00:38:01.280] what the limit is? [00:38:03.040] >> Well, I I imagine that it means [00:38:04.800] something like the sort of threshold of [00:38:06.640] what the conscious mind can recognize [00:38:10.320] and there’s somehow that threshold is [00:38:12.320] transcended by this information and you [00:38:14.560] learn to [00:38:15.200] >> but it’s not it’s not the barrier [00:38:17.040] between the subconscious and the [00:38:18.720] conscious mind. It’s the barrier between [00:38:23.359] your awareness. [00:38:26.079] >> Many times you can be consciously aware [00:38:28.640] of what’s going of what’s subconscious. [00:38:32.079] Many times there can be something going [00:38:34.880] around you and you’re not aware of it. [00:38:37.599] >> Yes. [00:38:38.320] >> And so the lemon is the barrier between [00:38:41.680] what you’re aware of and what you’re not [00:38:43.839] aware of. That’s why they can put u um [00:38:48.720] product placement in in uh sitcoms and [00:38:54.240] all this. And you know their product [00:38:58.480] goes across the screen right at the [00:39:00.400] funniest time. And [00:39:02.079] >> if you want an example of that, um, [00:39:05.599] >> uh, Top Flight the movie, [00:39:08.880] >> uh, the two guys, the two pilots are in [00:39:12.240] there getting chewed out by the [00:39:13.440] commander in the military office. Okay, [00:39:19.040] they walk out of the office and as they [00:39:22.000] do, a waiter comes by. In a military [00:39:25.440] office, a waiter comes by carrying a [00:39:28.640] tray full of drinks. [00:39:31.599] and they hit him with the door and the [00:39:34.480] drinks spill. And if you go frame by [00:39:38.400] frame by frame, okay, this tray of [00:39:42.960] drinks comes down across the screen as a [00:39:45.760] blur, a moving blur, and one frame of [00:39:50.960] that [00:39:52.720] as a very clear sign saying drink Pepsi [00:39:56.000] and then it blurs back out and goes back [00:39:58.160] out. You never see it. [00:40:00.960] >> Yeah. The subliminal. [00:40:02.160] >> You’re never aware of it and yet you saw [00:40:04.640] it with your eyes. Yeah. [00:40:06.480] >> Yeah. Fascinating. You know what this [00:40:08.000] reminds me of? And and I can’t believe I [00:40:10.240] forgot to go back to Monroe Institute [00:40:11.920] with you. Oh yeah. [00:40:12.960] >> Um this reminds me of when I was doing [00:40:15.359] the meditations at Monroe Institute, you [00:40:17.920] know, you did they did they use the [00:40:19.839] phrasing click out back then with you? [00:40:22.240] >> Yeah. [00:40:22.960] >> Yeah. So So you know, you’d be [00:40:24.320] meditating, you would click out, right? [00:40:26.240] So, at first you’re like, “What do you [00:40:28.640] mean I’m falling asleep?” It’s it’s the [00:40:30.480] same thing. [00:40:31.440] >> But the more you do it, I really did [00:40:34.079] start to get a sense that I was kind of [00:40:36.400] aware in a different way when I was in [00:40:39.440] the the quote unquote clicked out state. [00:40:41.920] And what really tipped me off to it is [00:40:43.920] sometimes I would feel like I was [00:40:45.599] becoming aware again in the middle of [00:40:48.640] something I was doing [00:40:50.720] >> somewhere else or some some [00:40:53.119] consciousness else, you know, and Uh [00:40:56.480] >> I I think that that is and and that’s [00:40:58.880] very similar to like what Jung for [00:41:00.960] instance would encourage with sort of [00:41:03.119] developing a relationship with the [00:41:05.440] unconscious through dreamwork through [00:41:07.280] active imagination. It’s like you’ve got [00:41:09.920] to find a way to connect these two [00:41:12.880] things because like like you’re saying [00:41:14.880] they don’t speak through language they [00:41:16.720] speak through symbols. They speak [00:41:18.480] through [00:41:18.880] >> that’s right [00:41:20.079] >> uh other kinds of more sort of nebulous [00:41:25.200] uh hard to determine ways. So it’s [00:41:28.880] almost like you’ve got to build a [00:41:30.319] language between these two regions of [00:41:33.359] mind. And it seems like in a lot of ways [00:41:35.440] that’s what remote viewing kind of is. [00:41:38.240] >> It is to a very strict degree. Um [00:41:42.079] uh your subconscious [00:41:44.960] um talks in pictures in simileies um in [00:41:50.880] um [00:41:52.400] um illustrations and pictures and all [00:41:56.240] this. Your conscious mind thinks in [00:41:58.480] nouns. We’ve been trained. [00:42:00.160] >> Yeah, [00:42:00.480] >> we’re English speakers. Our sentences [00:42:02.800] are built around the nouns, the subject. [00:42:06.000] And um so in the remote viewing training [00:42:09.520] that we give, we say no nouns. [00:42:14.800] And so you have something u here’s one [00:42:18.640] of my favorites. Um you get that the [00:42:22.000] target is red, it’s round, it’s rubbery. [00:42:26.079] Oh, it’s a ball. [00:42:30.960] It’s not a ball. [00:42:33.680] It’s a place that has [00:42:36.880] a red flower sitting in the kitchen. [00:42:41.680] There’s a rubber mat and uh [00:42:45.119] >> and in there there’s something the [00:42:47.040] rubber mat is round. Okay. And yet you [00:42:51.440] try to seize that noun. And so we make [00:42:54.480] everybody take every noun and set it [00:42:56.720] over to the side and say maybe it’s like [00:43:00.720] that but come back and describe it, [00:43:03.920] describe it. Describe it. And uh people [00:43:08.319] still form pictures in their head and [00:43:11.599] they’ll describe a target completely [00:43:16.960] 100% accurately [00:43:19.359] and they’ll look at the feedback and [00:43:20.960] they’ll say, “Oh, I missed it. That’s [00:43:23.839] not what I thought it was.” [00:43:26.880] >> Yeah. [00:43:27.839] >> We say, “You’re right. It’s not what you [00:43:30.160] thought it was, but you described it, [00:43:34.000] you know.” [00:43:34.720] >> Yeah. That’s very fascinating. So you [00:43:36.720] you did you did have a pretty impactful [00:43:39.280] experience at Monroe Institute, right? [00:43:41.839] Do you want to share that story? [00:43:44.720] >> Yeah. Um I didn’t believe in out-of- [00:43:47.520] body experiences. Okay. And uh I [00:43:50.560] thought, you know, I’d heard people say, [00:43:53.760] “Well, I can see their aura.” And you [00:43:56.240] know, I thought, “Oh, that’s just after [00:43:57.839] image. You stared too long at [00:43:59.520] something.” you know, and um and so [00:44:04.240] uh General Stubble had put me there [00:44:06.319] through the Monroe course, and I was [00:44:08.000] going through it and thinking, you know, [00:44:11.599] I’m here with all these fu people doing [00:44:15.680] fu things. And um one day I was in the [00:44:19.680] check unit, the uh unit where you lie [00:44:22.960] down and you listen to the uh tones. [00:44:26.079] >> Yeah. and um [00:44:28.880] I was trying to just nod off click out [00:44:32.960] and wasn’t having any success. And so my [00:44:37.200] nose started itching [00:44:39.359] and uh I thought no I’m going to click [00:44:43.200] out. I’m not going to let my you know [00:44:44.960] and the nose itched itch itched. And so [00:44:47.599] I finally raised up and scratched my [00:44:50.079] nose and it felt like I had gloves on. [00:44:52.960] M. [00:44:54.000] >> And I opened my eyes and this glowing [00:44:57.680] hand, [00:44:59.280] slightly glowing hand was scratching my [00:45:03.200] nose and I looked down and my real hand, [00:45:06.240] physical hand was still down across my [00:45:10.160] stomach, you know. [00:45:11.680] >> Wow. [00:45:12.800] >> And when that happened, I thought, [00:45:16.640] that’s neat. [00:45:19.280] It actually works. [00:45:20.800] >> Yeah. And so I’d heard that, you know, [00:45:22.880] the spirit hand can go through walls and [00:45:25.200] all that. And so I started putting my [00:45:28.800] hand through the wall and through the [00:45:31.520] bed and everything else and um and [00:45:36.720] you know pointing to my other hand and [00:45:40.800] and uh and just trying all these [00:45:43.680] experiments with it. And then I thought, [00:45:46.000] okay, I’m going to put this hand back [00:45:47.680] into my physical hand, pull it out [00:45:50.400] again, and do that several times so I [00:45:52.800] can practice how to do it. I put it in, [00:45:56.000] and that’s the last out-of- body [00:45:58.160] experience I’ve ever had. [00:45:59.920] >> So, [00:46:00.400] >> I had an out of arm experience, [00:46:02.160] >> right? Yeah. [00:46:03.680] >> But, but that is impactful. And when it [00:46:05.920] happens, it’s it’s enough to show you [00:46:08.000] unequivocally that okay, that’s real. [00:46:11.280] And and this is similar to what what [00:46:12.720] happened to me, Lynn, because I’m [00:46:15.119] I’m not a skep I wouldn’t consider [00:46:16.720] myself a skeptic like I mean I talk [00:46:18.960] about this stuff I’m interested in this [00:46:20.480] stuff but I’m also very aware that [00:46:22.560] there’s a difference between having an [00:46:24.000] intellectual interest in something and [00:46:25.920] really experiencing it not bullshitting [00:46:28.240] yourself knowing that like this is [00:46:30.960] really real and I didn’t just imagine it [00:46:33.520] and as as you said you go to Monroe [00:46:35.520] Institute [00:46:37.040] >> they’re encouraging they’re encouraging [00:46:39.119] you know use your imagination do all [00:46:40.880] these things and I think that’s great in [00:46:43.040] some ways but I also wanted to have a [00:46:45.440] real experience when I was there. Um, [00:46:48.640] and to my great shock, on the very last [00:46:51.920] day of the retreat, I I clicked out. I [00:46:55.359] had this weird like lucid lucid dream [00:46:58.079] experience that was unlike anything I [00:47:00.319] experienced at any other time in the [00:47:02.000] retreat where it felt completely normal, [00:47:04.720] like I was just standing standing in a [00:47:06.800] different room. [00:47:07.680] >> And I slowly was [00:47:09.680] >> retracing my steps and being like, [00:47:12.160] >> how how the hell did I get in this room? [00:47:13.920] like I don’t remember walking here. I [00:47:15.680] don’t remember. And then as soon as I [00:47:17.520] realized I did not walk to this room, [00:47:19.520] I’m in the check unit meditating. [00:47:21.520] >> I came back. I was in the check unit and [00:47:24.079] you know the the vibrations and energy [00:47:26.160] and all that stuff that they teach you [00:47:28.160] to, you know, evoke was going crazy, [00:47:31.599] like really really strong. And then I [00:47:33.839] tried to move and I peeled out and I [00:47:36.240] just like, you know, this vibrating [00:47:39.200] energetic [00:47:40.960] kind of body shape just started going [00:47:43.359] like like kind of vibrating. Yeah. Like [00:47:46.800] coming out and it was terrifying. It was [00:47:49.599] absolutely It’s exactly like how Bob [00:47:51.599] described it in Journeys Out of the [00:47:53.520] Body. You’re just terrified. [00:47:55.839] >> You can’t you can’t intellectualize it [00:47:58.640] and reason with yourself. like it’s just [00:48:01.040] everything in you is terrified. And so I [00:48:04.160] was, you know, [00:48:04.800] >> I wasn’t. My reaction to things like [00:48:07.119] that is, [00:48:08.720] >> man, that’s neat. And, you know, u my [00:48:13.599] hand was up here doing things [00:48:15.839] >> and I lifted my head up and I made sure [00:48:18.319] that I was awake. [00:48:19.680] >> Yeah. [00:48:19.920] >> I was wide awake. Yeah. So, [00:48:22.079] >> but Yeah. Go ahead. You were terrified. [00:48:24.559] >> Yeah. Yeah. I was I was terrified. I got [00:48:26.720] back in my body and I had that very much [00:48:29.280] sort of like a adrenaline dump feeling [00:48:32.240] like almost like you were just in a car [00:48:33.760] accident or [00:48:35.119] >> something like that. [00:48:36.480] >> And you know coming out of that [00:48:38.000] experience all all I can say is [00:48:40.720] >> that’s a real thing. Like I know that I [00:48:42.640] experienced that [00:48:44.400] >> just like I know I’m sitting in this [00:48:45.839] room right now but beyond that I don’t [00:48:48.240] know [ __ ] I don’t know anything else [00:48:49.680] beyond that. Um I didn’t get to see I [00:48:51.920] didn’t get to turn around and see myself [00:48:53.520] fully. I didn’t get to like go out of [00:48:55.839] the check unit. I just felt the [00:48:58.160] extremely, you know, strong, undeniable [00:49:02.000] sensation of that separation and that [00:49:05.200] whatever that energy is [00:49:07.359] >> floating upward and that was enough to [00:49:09.839] just be like, [00:49:11.359] >> okay, I if if I can’t say that that was [00:49:14.800] real, I can’t really say that sitting in [00:49:16.640] this room right now was real. It felt it [00:49:18.240] felt that that visceral and that uh [00:49:20.880] convincing. [00:49:21.920] >> Yeah. [00:49:23.200] Yeah. Um there’s an old saying that, you [00:49:25.520] know, once you see a white crow, you can [00:49:29.040] no longer say that crows can’t be [00:49:32.160] anything but black, [00:49:33.520] >> right? [00:49:34.160] >> You know, um Greg Seard was looking for [00:49:37.040] a a logo and all that. And I told him [00:49:40.319] that and he adopted the White Crow as [00:49:42.800] his company name and all that. [00:49:44.880] >> That’s cool. And that’s cool. [00:49:46.319] >> There are such things as white crows. [00:49:48.319] They’re rare, you know, but there are [00:49:50.960] such things. [00:49:52.720] Do you think that that experience at [00:49:55.040] like I you know a lot of people [00:49:56.640] listening may not be aware but I know [00:49:59.040] you’re very aware and anybody who’s like [00:50:00.960] really dived into remote viewing is [00:50:03.920] aware that these are very uh distinct [00:50:06.960] things in some ways like you don’t need [00:50:08.720] to go to Monroe Institute and have an [00:50:10.720] out of body to remote view and vice [00:50:13.280] versa but do you think that experiences [00:50:16.000] like that do help kind of wake something [00:50:18.640] up within you or do you think it’s [00:50:20.800] >> absolutely Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes, [00:50:23.200] they did for me anyway. Yeah. Um Yeah. [00:50:27.440] Um [00:50:29.760] you know, going to the unit, going to [00:50:32.240] Monroe and all that, there were many [00:50:34.960] things that my Baptist upbringing didn’t [00:50:38.400] really didn’t prepare me for [00:50:41.760] that uh that I had to finally say, “Hey, [00:50:46.960] this is real. I’m not going to hell for [00:50:50.000] it. [00:50:51.119] is, you know, and uh [00:50:54.240] >> Yeah. So, one of one of the things you [00:50:56.720] said in the book that I found really [00:50:58.400] interesting, like to be a really [00:50:59.760] interesting piece of nuance is the [00:51:02.079] differences in the skills of the remote [00:51:04.319] viewers and how they find themselves [00:51:06.319] accessing information and that you were [00:51:08.640] particularly good at getting into [00:51:10.480] people’s minds and seeing what people’s [00:51:12.720] minds were doing. Um, how did you [00:51:15.839] realize that and and what are some sort [00:51:18.000] of notable uh targets that you you can [00:51:21.920] share? [00:51:22.319] >> Uh, I realized it because I was keeping [00:51:26.000] the data for the unit. I I became the [00:51:28.720] database manager and I realized it [00:51:31.440] because every time I got one of those, [00:51:33.599] my accuracy went skyhigh. H. [00:51:37.599] >> And uh [00:51:39.839] uh [00:51:40.559] >> so sorry to interrupt, but that would be [00:51:42.800] that would be a a tasking like [00:51:45.440] essentially asking you to like what is [00:51:47.359] this person what is this person thinking [00:51:50.000] or something, right? [00:51:51.040] >> What is this person thinking? What is [00:51:52.640] this person doing? What are their plans [00:51:54.319] and intentions? [00:51:55.520] >> Yeah. Um [00:51:57.760] uh two of the [00:52:00.880] uh [00:52:02.720] really [00:52:05.440] deep things where you do that is plans [00:52:07.680] and intentions and the other one is [00:52:10.079] personality profile. [00:52:12.559] Uh plans and intentions is much deeper [00:52:14.880] and harder than personality profile [00:52:17.359] because personality profile you just [00:52:19.760] access a person describe what they do, [00:52:21.920] how they act and all this other stuff. [00:52:24.559] Um, but you get into their mind for [00:52:27.920] their plans and intentions, but um, [00:52:32.480] you know, we would get targets like that [00:52:34.559] and [00:52:36.960] I wouldn’t know what the target was. I [00:52:38.800] mean I just just a number and they would [00:52:41.839] lead me to a person and describe the [00:52:44.559] person and um and [00:52:49.280] doing the database later after we got [00:52:51.760] the feedback um I realized hey this is a [00:52:57.040] strong point for me I don’t understand [00:52:58.720] why but it is [00:53:00.400] >> so fascinating and and we didn’t [00:53:02.000] specifically say this but when when you [00:53:04.559] are tasked you you’re literally [00:53:06.720] receiving like a string of numbers [00:53:08.720] There’s no there’s basically no loaded [00:53:11.839] information. Um we we didn’t say that [00:53:14.400] specific. There’s obviously different [00:53:15.760] ways you can task in remote viewing, but [00:53:17.920] in CRV like you were doing at at Fort [00:53:20.160] me, they would just give you [00:53:21.839] >> this random string of numbers and that’s [00:53:24.079] all you had to go on, right? [00:53:26.240] >> Yeah. Um and um you know you can um [00:53:34.000] you can say to a trained remote viewer [00:53:36.559] you can say um this is project number [00:53:41.839] 970404. [00:53:43.599] >> Yeah. [00:53:44.160] >> Question three. What’s the answer? [00:53:48.240] >> Wow. Now there’s also front loing [00:53:52.240] where you may have a very complex [00:53:55.440] target. Okay, let’s say it’s a hotel and [00:54:01.280] um outside the hotel there’s a a bay and [00:54:05.200] there’s [00:54:06.720] boats on the bay, paddle boats and all [00:54:08.640] this. There’s a u a bar out in the water [00:54:13.359] where people sit and drink and people [00:54:16.240] all over the beach, parking lot and [00:54:18.240] everything else. [00:54:20.160] And what they will say is, um, here’s a [00:54:23.520] target. [00:54:25.520] Describe the targeted activity because [00:54:28.960] that’s what we’re interested in. [00:54:31.520] >> Okay. [00:54:33.599] There are [00:54:35.760] dozens and dozens of activities going on [00:54:38.079] there, [00:54:39.040] >> right? [00:54:39.440] >> But they don’t want you spending five [00:54:42.079] hours describing a hotel building, [00:54:46.640] you know, if if what the customer wants [00:54:51.359] is a description of some meeting that’s [00:54:54.880] going on in a conference room. [00:54:57.599] And so, uh, they may give you neutral [00:55:02.160] front-loading, [00:55:03.839] but they would never say, you know, [00:55:06.000] there’s a meeting going on in the [00:55:07.359] conference room. Tell me what they’re [00:55:08.800] discussing. That’s pollution. [00:55:12.400] >> But they can say, you know, here’s a [00:55:15.440] complex target. Just describe the [00:55:17.200] activity part of it. [00:55:19.680] >> Things like that. [00:55:20.880] >> Yeah. Yeah. And that also brings to mind [00:55:23.040] like you know um obviously this is cold [00:55:25.680] war era when you were active. So there [00:55:28.319] would be something like you know there’s [00:55:29.839] the famous case of uh the giant building [00:55:32.880] where Joe McMongle remote viewed the the [00:55:35.440] submarine. And then there’s a story you [00:55:37.119] tell in your book where there’s this [00:55:39.599] strange uh technology that they wanted [00:55:43.520] you to like literally get inside of and [00:55:45.839] try to like become part of this like [00:55:48.160] beam. [00:55:48.640] >> A death. It was a death ray. Yeah. [00:55:50.720] Uh-huh. [00:55:51.280] >> Yeah. Would you would you share that [00:55:52.640] story? [00:55:54.000] >> Uh, yeah. They had this uh particle beam [00:55:56.400] weapon over in Russia and uh they wanted [00:56:01.359] to know what was going on inside the [00:56:03.440] beam. Uh an analysis of the beam itself, [00:56:09.040] not the equipment or anything like that. [00:56:11.680] And of course, a particle beam [00:56:14.960] like that, you can’t stick an instrument [00:56:17.040] in there because it’s immediately just [00:56:20.240] vaporized [00:56:22.079] and uh so somebody had the brilliant [00:56:25.119] idea of let’s stick a remote viewer in [00:56:27.200] there and see if that works. [00:56:28.400] >> Yeah. [00:56:28.880] >> And uh I go at life with curiosity [00:56:34.160] and so they offered it and I said, “Oh, [00:56:37.280] this that’s neat. I’ll try it.” you [00:56:39.440] know, and uh stepped into the beam [00:56:43.440] and um [00:56:47.520] it was the experience [00:56:51.119] was indescribably beautiful. I’ve never [00:56:55.359] been able to adequately describe it. But [00:56:58.079] also at the same time, I realized that [00:57:01.760] um time inside that beam is totally [00:57:05.520] messed up. M [00:57:07.119] >> and um the um beam what I saw that what [00:57:12.079] the customer wanted was the beam was [00:57:14.160] circling counterclockwise [00:57:17.040] as it comes out and uh and the uh [00:57:21.839] equipment doesn’t do that. The beam [00:57:23.760] itself starts circling counterclockwise [00:57:26.880] and uh so that was what they wanted. But [00:57:30.640] the experience of that, of the colors, [00:57:34.960] the feelings, the uh experience of [00:57:40.880] standing still and being totally [00:57:42.720] timeless, but looking one way and seeing [00:57:45.839] my past and looking another way and [00:57:48.400] seeing my future. And uh if I moved in [00:57:52.400] the beam, it would, you know, uh it was [00:57:58.720] it was indescribable [00:58:01.119] >> really. Uh the experience of it. I I’ve [00:58:03.839] never been able to [00:58:06.880] adequately tell anybody what it was [00:58:08.640] like. It was just [00:58:10.640] >> the most beautiful thing I’ve ever seen [00:58:12.240] in my life. Yeah, [00:58:13.440] >> that’s really fascinating. I almost like [00:58:15.839] just my mind conjures like something [00:58:17.760] psychedelic looking or something. just [00:58:19.599] some kind of [00:58:20.240] >> Oh, totally [00:58:20.960] >> almost like kaleidoscopic beautiful [00:58:23.520] geometric [00:58:24.880] >> patterns or something like that. [00:58:26.240] >> Mega mega psychedelic. Yeah. [00:58:28.480] >> Very interesting. Very interesting. So [00:58:30.319] So did did we do we know exactly what [00:58:34.400] that thing was? Like what the technology [00:58:36.960] they were using was. [00:58:39.839] >> Oh yeah. Yeah. They uh they knew what it [00:58:43.440] was. They knew where it was. uh knew uh [00:58:48.319] I think [00:58:50.480] how it worked, everything else. What [00:58:53.520] they seem to be interested in was what’s [00:58:57.599] happening inside the beam itself. [00:59:00.720] >> And so that seemed to be what they were [00:59:02.559] tasing me with. Yeah. [00:59:04.799] >> Interesting. Interesting. Was it more [00:59:07.119] just to see like what would happen if [00:59:09.599] you did it or was there actually like [00:59:11.200] some piece of um like intelligence they [00:59:14.079] were after? [00:59:15.280] as I got it later, you know, for [00:59:17.760] feedback, they were interested in what [00:59:20.319] goes on inside the beam. Yeah. [00:59:22.079] >> Okay. Okay. [00:59:24.079] Weird. Weird. Um, what other targets [00:59:27.520] stick out to you as just really [00:59:30.240] important moments for yourself or that [00:59:32.079] maybe taught you something about [00:59:34.720] reality or um, anything that like um [00:59:39.359] like um, you know, Paul Smith has that [00:59:41.200] crazy story about [00:59:44.079] remote viewing the uh, incident on the [00:59:46.720] USS Stark and like you know like the the [00:59:50.000] next day or couple days after the exact [00:59:52.400] thing that he remote viewed. There have [00:59:54.000] been there have been many of those um uh [00:59:59.440] um with each of the remote viewers. Uh [01:00:02.799] one of mine on that was uh Chernobyl. [01:00:06.720] Um, [01:00:07.119] >> oh yeah, [01:00:07.839] >> I saw and described the event what um [01:00:12.480] >> actually two days before it happened, [01:00:14.559] but it didn’t come out in the news until [01:00:17.040] about 5 days later um when Iceland [01:00:21.359] reported this cloud of radioactive [01:00:24.720] coming across Iceland. Um but um [01:00:29.359] uh yeah, that happened. Uh, I know [01:00:33.040] um Paul talks about the start, but every [01:00:36.720] one of the remote viewers in the unit [01:00:38.880] has an experience like that that they [01:00:41.760] can talk about and um um not just one [01:00:46.160] but many. [01:00:48.079] Um but as far as a personal thing [01:00:52.559] um the one target that has always stood [01:00:55.760] out to me is personal. Uh I was good at [01:01:02.319] accessing people [01:01:04.640] and so um [01:01:07.119] they had given me Sodom Hussein over and [01:01:10.640] over and over. The man was flipping out [01:01:13.920] crazy [01:01:15.520] uh evil, mean and uh and I got tired of [01:01:22.160] it. And I went into the director and I [01:01:24.880] said, “Uh, look, give me Boza the Clown. [01:01:27.440] give me. Mother Teres said, “Give me [01:01:29.680] give me a break.” [01:01:31.920] And he said, “You’re a soldier. Shut up [01:01:36.000] and do your damn job. Do what you’re [01:01:38.240] asked. Do what you’re told.” Yeah. And [01:01:41.440] so I went back and some maybe a week [01:01:46.400] later, [01:01:47.920] um, there was no seemingly nothing going [01:01:50.640] on in the world. And so I was to do a [01:01:54.000] personality profile [01:01:58.160] and um [01:02:00.799] um so the envelope was sealed and I [01:02:05.839] started my session and I thought wait a [01:02:08.079] minute this isn’t Sodom Hussein. [01:02:11.520] And I started on and on you know and uh [01:02:15.839] I said you got the wrong guy. this is a [01:02:19.040] this is a good person. [01:02:21.440] And I think my monitor was Bill Ray at [01:02:23.839] the time [01:02:24.720] >> and he said just go on with it. [01:02:27.200] >> And so I did and um at the end of the [01:02:31.119] session I felt like I was just glowing. [01:02:34.640] I’d had this PSI experience [01:02:38.079] um a little bit beyond my location and [01:02:41.440] um [01:02:43.280] uh my summary was whatever you think you [01:02:46.880] you think this guy did, he didn’t do it. [01:02:50.240] And um so we ended the session, [01:02:55.760] the monitor opened the envelope and the [01:02:59.040] director had handwritten across a page [01:03:03.280] Jesus. [01:03:04.400] >> Yeah. [01:03:05.680] >> And u [01:03:08.400] I’m not going to say I met Jesus in [01:03:10.319] person, okay? [01:03:12.720] But mentally I actually met Jesus in [01:03:16.720] person. And [01:03:19.680] what he explained to me changed my life. [01:03:22.559] >> Wow. [01:03:22.880] >> It really did. [01:03:24.160] >> Wow. Yeah. I remember that story from [01:03:26.480] the book. And I I feel like that’s one [01:03:27.760] of those stories that Well, first of [01:03:29.359] all, thanks for bringing that up because [01:03:30.960] this is also a really good pivot point [01:03:32.720] into some of the more anomalous exotic [01:03:35.359] targets that are, you know, dangerous to [01:03:38.000] navigate, but we have to, right? Um, but [01:03:41.280] yeah, I mean that that kind of an [01:03:42.960] experience and then I mean what what was [01:03:44.720] the feeling that came over you after you [01:03:47.520] saw that that was the target? Was there [01:03:49.200] a part of you that was already [01:03:50.319] suspecting that or did was it like the [01:03:52.720] hairs stood up on your what was that [01:03:55.280] like? [01:03:56.319] >> I didn’t suspect it in session. In [01:03:59.839] session um I had the PSI experience [01:04:03.440] which is a little bit beyond by [01:04:04.960] location. by location. You know you’re [01:04:08.160] at the target, but you’re also at the [01:04:10.079] table writing things down. And that’s [01:04:12.480] okay. Uh the beyond that, it gets to [01:04:17.039] where you can’t tell you’re not at the [01:04:18.799] target. And uh just like you found [01:04:22.400] yourself in another room. [01:04:24.000] >> Yeah. Monroe. [01:04:25.440] >> Wow. And I found myself standing in [01:04:27.760] front of this [01:04:29.680] short little Jewish looking guy [01:04:32.799] in a modern suit. [01:04:36.000] >> Oh, interesting. [01:04:36.799] >> Modern dress and all that. And um [01:04:41.359] and [01:04:43.440] I’ve [01:04:45.119] you know I had done the personality [01:04:47.920] assessment and I felt dirty [01:04:51.039] being around this guy [01:04:53.039] >> and I thought you know [01:04:56.000] how could I ever [01:04:58.799] be like this guy? I wish I could. I [01:05:01.680] can’t. And uh so what he let me know is [01:05:08.079] whatever you’ve done bad I’ve seen [01:05:11.119] worse. Whatever you’ve done good [01:05:15.200] I’ve seen better [01:05:18.559] I love you anyway. [01:05:20.559] >> Wow. [01:05:22.079] >> And that’s when I came out of that came [01:05:25.359] back to it and uh [01:05:29.200] that changed my life. all this uh you [01:05:32.559] know growing up you dance with that girl [01:05:36.160] or you look at her that way you’re going [01:05:37.920] to hail and all that you know. [01:05:39.839] >> Yeah. Yeah. [01:05:40.720] >> All of a sudden that [01:05:43.440] I saw it for what it really was. [01:05:45.680] >> Yeah. [01:05:46.319] >> Yeah. [01:05:46.640] >> It’s it’s so simple but it’s so profound [01:05:48.640] and that that’s just like [01:05:50.079] >> Oh yeah. [01:05:50.960] >> That’s that’s beautiful. Um, so on the [01:05:54.960] subject of more anomalous targets, th [01:05:57.680] this is such a a difficult one to [01:05:59.440] navigate because everyone wants to hear [01:06:00.960] about it, but all of the, you know, [01:06:03.200] responsible remote viewers want to be [01:06:05.680] really careful with this because this is [01:06:07.200] an arena where you probably can’t get [01:06:09.200] feedback, right? You can’t if if I ask [01:06:11.280] you to like remote view alien [01:06:13.119] intelligence or uh uh you know any any [01:06:17.359] kind of paranormal thing, how can you [01:06:19.359] ever get the you know the the feedback [01:06:21.119] to prove that this happened? So it’s you [01:06:23.200] know it’s a it’s a playground for like [01:06:25.119] selfdeception. [01:06:26.960] >> Yeah. [01:06:27.280] >> But eventually so you don’t use his name [01:06:28.799] in the book but his name has since come [01:06:30.319] out all over the place. Um so eventually [01:06:33.280] Ed Dames is working at um at Fort me and [01:06:38.079] he is not in charge. Skip Atwater is in [01:06:41.200] charge at this time I believe. [01:06:42.559] >> Yeah. [01:06:43.119] >> And um but Ed Dames would still task you [01:06:46.960] guys at times. And he developed this [01:06:50.559] >> with ETS. Yeah. [01:06:52.160] >> Yeah. He was told not to and he did [01:06:54.240] anyway. Yeah. [01:06:55.200] >> Yeah. Yeah. So, it seems universally to [01:06:58.720] me, and correct me if I’m wrong, that [01:07:00.880] the that the viewers did not really like [01:07:02.880] this and they complained about it. [01:07:04.880] >> No. [01:07:06.559] >> Uh, actually, what we didn’t like, okay, [01:07:11.520] was not [01:07:13.599] the getting of ET targets. [01:07:16.240] What we didn’t like was [01:07:19.760] we would view along and you talk out [01:07:22.640] loud as you write things down and we [01:07:26.240] would write down, you know, something [01:07:28.799] that we saw [01:07:31.119] and Ed as the monitor is there to keep [01:07:33.760] you in structure only. [01:07:37.680] And Ed would say, you know, you would [01:07:40.640] say, um, I see something red. And it [01:07:45.039] would say, “Don’t you mean green?” [01:07:48.960] >> Yeah. [01:07:49.359] >> You know, and uh and you know, he he [01:07:54.880] would tell you what you found in spite [01:07:57.680] of what you found. And so it finally got [01:08:00.720] to where [01:08:02.400] we would go over and we would just humor [01:08:04.799] Ed. We’d say something. he’d say [01:08:09.119] what he thought it was and we’d just [01:08:11.440] write it down and get the session over [01:08:13.599] with and leave and uh and we knew it was [01:08:18.080] all garbage anyway. [01:08:20.319] But um what Ed would do was he would [01:08:22.799] view a target, usually an ET target. He [01:08:27.120] would get his results and then as you [01:08:31.120] worked through your session, he would [01:08:33.279] guide you to get his results, too. [01:08:36.719] And that’s what we that’s what we didn’t [01:08:39.359] like. [01:08:40.400] >> Yeah. Major pollution, right? Like you [01:08:42.400] can’t even [01:08:42.880] >> Oh, yeah. [01:08:43.279] >> And it seems like it would break you out [01:08:44.719] of your flow, too. Like you’re to have [01:08:47.359] >> Oh, yeah. We just quit remote viewing. [01:08:49.359] >> Yeah. We just We just started. Okay. [01:08:52.560] Whatever it tells me, I’ll write it [01:08:54.000] down, you know. [01:08:55.520] So, so [01:08:57.359] with that said, there are these [01:08:59.839] anomalous targets that are pretty well [01:09:03.040] known that the people involved in the [01:09:04.960] viewing of them seem to have pretty high [01:09:07.279] conviction that they’re probably real. [01:09:10.000] Like Project 8200 might be one of the [01:09:13.040] best known ones. Um, and for people that [01:09:16.640] don’t know this story, this was after [01:09:19.040] your time with the unit, I I believe, [01:09:20.880] right? Uh but I uh no this was um [01:09:25.440] actually before my time in the unit. [01:09:27.600] Okay. However, I hadn’t heard about it [01:09:30.400] until they had me do those sessions. [01:09:32.880] >> Oh, so I didn’t know you were in those [01:09:34.560] sessions. [01:09:35.839] >> Oh, yeah. Uh there were four at bases. [01:09:39.520] >> Yeah. [01:09:39.839] >> Uh I was tasked to do three of them. I [01:09:42.080] never did the one in the Pyrenees. [01:09:44.159] >> Okay. [01:09:44.560] >> Up in the Pyrenees Mountains in Spain. [01:09:46.880] Uh, I did the other three and uh did uh [01:09:51.759] work on them that u [01:09:55.040] matched extremely closely to Pat Price’s [01:09:58.880] descriptions which I had never seen. I [01:10:01.040] didn’t even know. I had never heard of [01:10:03.679] that those targets before. [01:10:05.760] >> Yeah. [01:10:06.320] >> Uh I got numbers, [01:10:09.280] you know. [01:10:10.320] >> And um [01:10:12.400] uh so [01:10:14.320] uh yeah, I had done those. I don’t know [01:10:16.560] if they’re in u [01:10:19.360] the book 8200. Is that um [01:10:22.000] >> that Yeah, that’s why that’s why I [01:10:23.920] thought you you weren’t because I think [01:10:25.440] I it’s been a while since I’ve looked at [01:10:27.920] it, but I Yeah, I thought I remembered [01:10:29.760] your name not not being in there, so I [01:10:31.840] assumed that you weren’t. [01:10:33.040] >> I I’m not surprised at that. Yeah. [01:10:35.360] >> Interesting. [01:10:37.199] >> Um well, just to take a step back, [01:10:38.880] >> I have never I have never minded not [01:10:41.440] being that way. I know uh at the uh [01:10:45.760] conference in uh in California that we [01:10:49.520] had for the Irv conference, IRBA, [01:10:52.480] >> International Remote Viewers [01:10:53.760] Association, Paul gave a list of [01:10:56.080] everybody who had ever been in the unit. [01:11:00.239] >> My name wasn’t on that list. [01:11:01.760] >> Oh, what the hell? Why? Why? [01:11:04.000] >> I don’t know. I don’t know, [01:11:05.440] >> man. That’s weird. [01:11:06.320] >> Oh. Um [01:11:07.360] >> but uh [01:11:09.520] uh yeah [01:11:11.760] um [01:11:12.320] >> well can I take [01:11:13.520] >> I I spent my whole career not existing [01:11:17.520] and so I don’t mind I don’t mind that [01:11:20.640] >> well well I I mind on your behalf. I [01:11:22.719] mind on your behalf. Um to take to take [01:11:24.960] a step back just to review this project [01:11:27.120] 8200 um sequence of events. So this is [01:11:30.719] something that hearkens back to the [01:11:32.239] early days of project Stargate when this [01:11:35.280] pre Fort me. So this is during the the [01:11:38.239] SRRI days. There’s this, you know, this [01:11:40.480] rockstar remote viewer Pat Price. He [01:11:43.120] remote views these what he says [01:11:45.520] essentially are four [01:11:47.360] >> UFO bases. He gives this information to [01:11:51.120] um [01:11:52.239] >> Hal Pututoff. Years go by. Hal Puto off [01:11:55.920] apparently gives the information to Skip [01:11:58.480] Atwater in in your era and then he just [01:12:02.080] kind of says you might think this is [01:12:05.120] interesting. Maybe you want to task your [01:12:07.040] guys with it. Um so then he does he [01:12:09.600] tasks you he tasks uh Mc Monagle with [01:12:12.560] all of them I believe. Um and then a [01:12:15.920] number of the other viewers get like one [01:12:17.679] site or whatever. [01:12:19.120] >> But so what was your experience like [01:12:21.280] with this? What did you what did you see [01:12:22.960] at these targets? [01:12:25.040] Um, the one I saw at Mount Hayes up in [01:12:27.840] Alaska was that the place had was still [01:12:32.480] there, but it had virtually closed down [01:12:35.440] to just a skeleton crew of aliens and uh [01:12:40.960] was not being used all that much at the [01:12:44.320] time. Um, I found that this goes along [01:12:47.840] with what Joe and and some of the others [01:12:50.080] found as they worked the process through [01:12:53.520] time. Um the uh one in Zimbabwe [01:12:59.920] uh I found to be a repair place, [01:13:02.640] >> a UFO repair place and um sunken into [01:13:07.520] the ground and um the one in uh [01:13:13.840] Mount Zeal in northern Australia. Uh [01:13:18.480] that’s the one that [01:13:20.960] really got me the most. Um, I had [01:13:25.440] described it as sort of an airport, [01:13:28.880] an incoming [01:13:31.120] uh where [01:13:33.760] UFOs [01:13:35.440] from wherever sort of report there [01:13:38.560] before they go out across the world, you [01:13:41.040] know, and um uh got sort of a terminal [01:13:44.960] and all that. Now, I found out later [01:13:48.640] that Pat Price, when he had done that [01:13:51.840] one, had been spoken to by the ETSs [01:13:56.719] >> really. [01:13:57.199] >> And um and when I got to that one, [01:14:02.320] this [01:14:04.400] voice came to me sort of like over a [01:14:07.600] speaker or something said, “We know [01:14:10.000] you’re here and it’s okay. Look around.” [01:14:13.120] >> Wow. And so I looked around. Hey, I’m [01:14:16.640] invited in. That’s good. I looked around [01:14:18.960] and I started describing things and uh [01:14:21.840] the things I described basically exactly [01:14:24.800] matched what Pastor Bryce has found. Um [01:14:29.280] even down to the dimensions of the of [01:14:32.000] the ship and the shape of the ship and [01:14:34.320] all that. And um so I spent a lot of [01:14:38.640] time in there doing a lot of [01:14:40.080] descriptions of it. I don’t know what [01:14:42.320] ever happened to that uh [01:14:44.000] >> Wow. [01:14:44.800] >> to that transcript, [01:14:46.880] but [01:14:47.280] >> that’s wild. [01:14:48.159] >> It was very thorough transcript. [01:14:50.800] >> How could they not include that, man? [01:14:52.560] That’s that’s a travesty. I wish I had [01:14:54.560] access to that. That’s amazing. [01:14:56.159] >> I don’t know. [01:14:56.719] >> Um when you hear this? So, first I want [01:14:59.840] to ask too, what did you did you get a s [01:15:02.960] What kind of sense did you get with [01:15:05.679] these beings? You you you said that [01:15:07.840] they’re you said that openly that [01:15:09.840] they’re aliens, but did they look alien? [01:15:12.719] Did they look human? Did they look like [01:15:14.800] one of these common races you hear [01:15:17.199] spoken about? [01:15:17.920] >> Uh some of them did. Some of them look [01:15:19.920] like little grays. Um there were others [01:15:23.120] that I would swear were human. [01:15:26.960] Not look like human, but were humans [01:15:29.440] working there. Uh, and uh, at this one [01:15:34.320] point I saw a female gray and a child [01:15:38.880] gray, [01:15:40.800] >> which I’ve never heard of anybody else [01:15:43.280] saying before. [01:15:44.960] >> Yeah. [01:15:45.360] >> But it was, you know, but um, [01:15:50.400] uh, basically I just looked around. [01:15:53.280] There were two levels. [01:15:55.360] um airport, [01:15:58.560] you know, level where you wait for wait [01:16:02.080] for planes out and planes coming in and [01:16:04.080] all that and then um sort of a repair [01:16:07.600] and utility place floor underneath [01:16:12.080] and uh so I just went around describing [01:16:15.840] things. That’s all. Um, I didn’t have [01:16:19.280] any [01:16:22.239] really reaction to it because uh, [01:16:27.040] you know, I was just describing a [01:16:30.000] target. That’s what I was doing, [01:16:31.520] >> right? [01:16:33.120] >> Yeah. And and I’d imagine you just kind [01:16:34.800] of train yourself to be that way because [01:16:37.040] emotions only going to get in the way of [01:16:39.040] doing good work, right? [01:16:40.080] >> That’s right. They do. Yeah. Um, so I [01:16:42.239] got to ask this since you your strongest [01:16:47.520] sort of talent seem to be accessing [01:16:50.159] minds. Did you access the mind of any of [01:16:54.080] these beings? [01:16:56.719] >> Not there. Not those. No. Uhuh. [01:17:00.000] >> But it’s when you say not those, it’s it [01:17:02.320] sounds like maybe on some other occasion [01:17:03.920] you did. [01:17:04.640] >> There were there were other targets that [01:17:06.320] we had where it did. Yeah. Uhhuh. [01:17:08.880] Please, please share if you can. [01:17:11.920] Uh there was one where um [01:17:16.239] the the feedback I got was it was on [01:17:18.880] Titan [01:17:21.040] and um [01:17:23.679] I was um to describe a a site [01:17:27.760] and uh this wasn’t frontloaded as [01:17:30.880] personality profile or anything like [01:17:32.480] that. just describe the site and I found [01:17:34.960] this very cold dark place and uh and it [01:17:39.920] was just rocks barren and it mountains [01:17:42.640] mountains and and things like that. And [01:17:46.080] uh I heard some noise and so I went to [01:17:49.679] this place and it was sort of a [01:17:53.600] a [01:17:55.840] cavern in a mountain in a mountain side [01:17:58.719] or something like that. And there were [01:18:00.000] these two beings and uh their [01:18:05.360] they were talking to each other but [01:18:07.760] their speech was totally [01:18:10.400] unintelligible. [01:18:12.159] And so I thought well I’ll get into the [01:18:13.760] mind seeing what they’re saying. And uh [01:18:16.960] when I did I have never seen anything so [01:18:21.280] totally [01:18:22.800] alien so totally nonhuman. I mean, we’ve [01:18:26.000] had to do animals before and things like [01:18:28.320] that, you know, and no, this was so [01:18:30.880] totally alien that there was no way to [01:18:34.159] humanly understand any part of it. And [01:18:38.320] so after trying that for a while, I [01:18:40.800] backed out um [01:18:43.920] and [01:18:45.760] described the surrounding territory and [01:18:47.760] ended the session. And that was [01:18:50.239] evidently [01:18:52.800] the target was the surface of Titan. [01:18:56.080] >> Wow. And and what what context was this [01:18:59.280] was this target given in? Was this [01:19:01.840] >> hard training? [01:19:02.800] >> Okay. Okay. [01:19:04.239] >> Practice. Yeah. There’s [01:19:06.400] >> Did you get this? [01:19:07.040] >> I distinguish between training and [01:19:08.800] practice, but you know. [01:19:10.560] >> Got it. Um, did you get the sense that [01:19:13.679] whoever tasked this already kind of knew [01:19:16.800] that there was something intelligent on [01:19:18.719] Titan or was it a completely random [01:19:22.480] >> I think it was just a completely random [01:19:24.480] thing. Yeah. [01:19:25.120] >> Wow. But now there are there are other [01:19:29.360] um things that I’ve done [01:19:33.040] practice sessions during the military um [01:19:36.480] working after the military working for [01:19:39.360] space organizations and all that where [01:19:43.440] uh we’ve [01:19:45.920] encountered other things and uh I have [01:19:51.440] done [01:19:53.440] um accessing mentally [01:19:55.520] and all that. Um [01:19:59.040] main mainly after the service. Um [01:20:02.560] anything that Ed gave us, I just blew it [01:20:05.840] off. [01:20:06.640] >> Wow. [01:20:07.040] >> You know, uh but after service, um we’ve [01:20:11.360] done work on the moon, on Mars, on other [01:20:17.280] star systems and planets and things like [01:20:19.440] that where we found intelligent life. [01:20:22.400] And um [01:20:24.719] uh [01:20:26.239] this one customer I can talk about this [01:20:29.600] in generalities. [01:20:31.280] >> Yeah. [01:20:31.760] >> Non non-disclosure agreements but uh um [01:20:36.239] task a um star system and wanted to know [01:20:42.719] whether there’d be any intelligent life. [01:20:45.600] And so um I did the session and in fact [01:20:49.760] um couple of uh on the team did the [01:20:53.440] session and um we found that there were [01:20:57.120] five planets going around the star. [01:21:00.640] Come to find out later once they learned [01:21:03.840] how to [01:21:06.320] tell there were planets going around the [01:21:08.000] star by the star wobbling and all that [01:21:10.640] >> uh from gravitational pull. Uh there are [01:21:13.360] five planets going around it. And um on [01:21:17.520] one planet we found a race of beings [01:21:23.280] that wound up physically describing, you [01:21:26.880] know, describing them physically wound [01:21:29.199] up looking sort of like Sasquatch. [01:21:32.880] >> Okay. hairy hairy and um intelligent but [01:21:39.199] with an IQ on our standard of maybe 90. [01:21:44.880] Their highest intelligence would be [01:21:46.800] maybe 90 on our scale. [01:21:49.440] >> They weren’t smart. Um but uh they were [01:21:53.679] being cultivated by another [01:21:57.520] group of aliens who would come in to [01:22:00.000] their planet, [01:22:02.480] give them training, give them [01:22:05.600] uh supplies and and all that. And those [01:22:09.040] would go out and dig up minerals [01:22:13.199] to deliver to the incoming people who [01:22:16.239] were bringing them food and all that, [01:22:18.159] you know. And so they were being [01:22:20.239] treated, you know, like uh like workers [01:22:23.280] on that planet to get minerals and and [01:22:27.040] provide it to the aliens who came into [01:22:30.080] that planet. [01:22:31.440] >> And uh [01:22:32.000] >> so they were interacting with something [01:22:33.520] more advanced. [01:22:35.520] >> Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. And the [01:22:38.080] thing is that this group [01:22:42.080] saw me there and interacted with me [01:22:45.199] which is extremely strange because using [01:22:48.320] the CRB protocol of ingos [01:22:52.080] you can’t get noticed [01:22:54.719] and u but they noticed me and all that. [01:22:58.320] Now the incoming beings they were never [01:23:01.440] able to even notice that I was there. [01:23:04.639] >> Wow. So, uh, [01:23:07.199] >> I gotta ask you, what the hell is going [01:23:09.679] on with the moon? What what do you think [01:23:11.840] is going on with the moon? Because [01:23:12.960] there’s, you know, it’s been it is [01:23:14.800] objectively so strange, right down to [01:23:18.080] its geometry, down to, you know, there’s [01:23:21.360] there’s been countless videos and essays [01:23:24.159] and books written about how the moon [01:23:26.800] just almost shouldn’t exist. It’s just [01:23:28.400] so perfect. It’s from its from its [01:23:31.280] >> size compared to the Earth, its [01:23:32.880] distance, its mass, the fact that it [01:23:34.800] seems to be hollow or partially hollow [01:23:37.440] based on the fact that they crashed this [01:23:38.880] lunar lander into it and it rung like a [01:23:41.199] bell. Of course, there’s so much lore [01:23:43.440] lore about um there being secret bases [01:23:47.040] on the moon. There being hidden beings [01:23:48.719] on the back side of the moon, the dark [01:23:50.719] side of the moon, even though it’s not [01:23:52.080] really dark. Um there’s a uh Paul has [01:23:55.440] Paul and Ingo have the story about [01:23:57.920] remote viewing something intelligent on [01:24:01.600] on the moon. What is your [01:24:04.000] >> I have too. Yeah, I have too. [01:24:05.679] >> Yeah, please please share. [01:24:06.800] >> And I’ve done some accessing there too [01:24:08.719] mentally. But um yeah um [01:24:14.159] one time uh one of the space agencies um [01:24:20.400] came and they said um [01:24:23.440] we want to build a facility on the moon. [01:24:28.080] The problem is how do we house the [01:24:31.199] people who are going up to build that [01:24:33.520] facility [01:24:35.280] since there’s no facility there to house [01:24:38.000] them. And uh so um my team and I um we [01:24:45.199] sort of cheated on this one. Uh [01:24:47.760] everybody was coming up with these [01:24:49.280] logical ideas. I said, “No, we’re [01:24:51.600] supposed to remote view this.” And they [01:24:54.880] said, “Oh, but here’s here’s how here’s [01:24:57.120] how to do it. I know how to do it.” And [01:24:58.639] all that. So, finally, I said, “Okay, [01:25:01.840] here’s your task. [01:25:04.480] Move mentally to this spot.” I gave him [01:25:07.199] the coordinates, you know, geographic [01:25:09.360] coordinates on the moon. I said, “Move [01:25:11.440] to this spot. [01:25:13.520] Now, mentally move forward in time to [01:25:17.280] where there is a targeted facility there [01:25:20.639] and describe it. [01:25:23.600] and they did. [01:25:25.760] And so [01:25:28.159] instead of giving the information we [01:25:31.679] were tasked to give, we moved and [01:25:34.639] described [01:25:36.400] the successful end result, brought it [01:25:39.040] back. I gave that to the uh uh agency [01:25:43.120] that was planning to build it on the [01:25:45.280] moon and uh um they were ecstatic. They [01:25:50.560] said we hadn’t thought of that before. [01:25:53.040] And so, um, I guess about five years [01:25:56.159] later, this was good [01:26:00.000] 25 years ago, um, I was out [01:26:05.600] at [01:26:08.159] a place located there in California. [01:26:11.920] And, uh, the guy said, “Well, here’s a [01:26:15.520] recent flyby of the moon.” And uh so he [01:26:20.560] showed me the flyby and he said, “I want [01:26:22.159] you to watch this on the screen.” And it [01:26:23.920] was just a picture of the moon, you [01:26:27.040] know, as they flew over and all that. [01:26:30.400] And u all of a sudden here was this [01:26:34.320] crater that went by with the plastic [01:26:36.239] bubble over it. [01:26:38.239] >> Really? [01:26:39.120] >> And I said, “Wait a minute. Stop the [01:26:41.120] movie. Stop the film.” And uh he said, [01:26:45.760] “Yeah, [01:26:47.280] I I thought you’d notice that.” [01:26:50.080] And he cut it off and I got no more [01:26:51.920] information. [01:26:52.880] >> Wow. [01:26:53.280] >> But what we had found was that if you [01:26:56.320] take a small crater, [01:27:00.080] put a plastic bubble over it, you know, [01:27:03.280] just [01:27:04.719] >> around the rim. [01:27:05.760] >> Yeah. [01:27:06.320] >> Seal it. [01:27:07.920] >> And it has to be a special plastic that [01:27:10.560] would keep out radiation and all that. [01:27:13.600] And what the viewers found was that [01:27:17.520] very complex plastic and buildings [01:27:20.400] inside. [01:27:22.159] And they found patches [01:27:24.800] on it. [01:27:26.719] And so I said, “Describe the patches.” [01:27:29.920] And they said, “It’s like duct tape.” [01:27:34.800] And u if if a meteorite, small meteorite [01:27:39.280] hits that thing and punches a hole, you [01:27:42.000] can go up and put duct tape over it. And [01:27:46.239] uh the air inside is at 16 pounds per [01:27:49.520] square inch, which is what it is at sea [01:27:51.520] level. And it’s half of what you put in [01:27:54.320] a bicycle tire. and uh you know and it’s [01:27:58.480] a place where they can be there and then [01:28:03.760] tunnel out of that small crater so they [01:28:07.440] can go to work and build whatever [01:28:09.040] they’re going to build. [01:28:10.159] >> Wow. [01:28:10.560] >> And uh so evidently [01:28:13.199] uh they took it and [01:28:15.600] and we’re starting to work. [01:28:17.280] >> So so you get the sense that this is us [01:28:19.679] in progress of doing something not [01:28:21.760] something else that was there [01:28:23.280] >> in that case. in that case. Yeah. [01:28:25.520] >> Okay. [01:28:26.080] >> Now, um I’ve done, you know, the um [01:28:30.480] alien things on the moon and they’re [01:28:33.199] there. Yeah, they’re there. [01:28:36.880] >> What What do you think they are? Are [01:28:38.960] they advanced? Are they You know, [01:28:41.280] there’s so many theories on this. Like [01:28:43.280] I’m a I’m a big fan of people like Jacqu [01:28:45.440] Valet and John Ke take kind of a more [01:28:49.040] >> um [01:28:50.320] >> I don’t know almost like [01:28:52.320] consciousness-based [01:28:54.639] uh interpretation of the phenomenon. But [01:28:57.280] I’m also a big fan of people like [01:28:59.120] Richard Dolan and his sort of like [01:29:00.639] breakaway civilization hypothesis that [01:29:03.679] there there could be very advanced [01:29:06.080] pockets of ancient humans that we [01:29:08.719] mistake as alien, but they’re actually [01:29:11.120] us from the distant past or maybe [01:29:12.960] they’re a group of modern people who [01:29:14.960] have access to some kind of anomalous [01:29:17.679] anti-gravity technologies or or [01:29:20.159] whatever. So there’s so many interesting [01:29:22.000] hypotheses with all of this stuff, but [01:29:24.639] um yeah. So, I guess let’s start with [01:29:27.280] that. What do you think is up there? [01:29:28.639] >> I don’t know if I should talk about this [01:29:30.080] or not, but I think I will. Um, I was in [01:29:34.480] El Paso one day and was [01:29:38.320] getting out of the car to go into a [01:29:40.000] restaurant. [01:29:40.719] >> Uhhuh. [01:29:41.199] >> And these two guys came up [01:29:44.480] and uh they said, “You’re Lynn Buchanan, [01:29:47.360] aren’t you?” And I thought, [01:29:51.520] “Nobody’s supposed to know you. maybe [01:29:54.320] they’ve seen me on a podcast or [01:29:55.840] something. And I said, “Yeah.” [01:29:57.520] >> And they said, “U, we have a question to [01:30:00.719] ask you.” And I said, “Well, I don’t I [01:30:03.920] don’t really do targets for people, you [01:30:05.760] know, I do it for police and companies [01:30:07.600] and all that, but not, you know.” And [01:30:11.120] they said, “No, we have a question. Um, [01:30:14.960] we need to know who is [01:30:18.639] doing the inspection and the [01:30:21.040] investigation and study of the [01:30:25.600] other wedge on the DNA chart. [01:30:30.000] >> Wow. [01:30:31.679] >> And I said, “Well, I don’t know.” And [01:30:35.600] they said, “Well, can you find out for [01:30:37.920] us?” [01:30:40.080] And I immediately thought of Linda [01:30:41.760] Molton How because she Yeah. I mean, she [01:30:44.000] knows everything and she’s a good friend [01:30:45.840] of mine. And uh so I said, “I’ll see if [01:30:49.760] I can find out, you know.” [01:30:52.239] >> And uh anyway, we got to talking and [01:30:55.360] they said, “Uh [01:30:58.159] this guy, I don’t know if they were [01:31:00.719] lying, [01:31:02.000] >> so I have no proof of anything he said.” [01:31:05.760] Okay, it’s what he told me. He said, um, [01:31:10.400] uh, when the [01:31:14.000] I guess you could call them the [01:31:15.199] Anunnaki, I forget what he called them, [01:31:17.920] uh, left the earth way back then. They [01:31:22.000] took human slaves with them who have [01:31:24.320] been in slavery all these centuries on [01:31:28.480] other planets. [01:31:30.400] And uh, he said there have been genetic [01:31:33.280] changes. [01:31:35.120] And he said, uh, as [01:31:38.960] we come back here as slaves now, some of [01:31:41.520] us are able to escape. [01:31:44.080] And he said, we’re trying to fit into [01:31:47.440] civilization, you know, into the humans. [01:31:50.960] And uh, he said, “We don’t want control. [01:31:55.199] We don’t want politics. We don’t want [01:31:57.520] anything. We’ve been in slavery for [01:32:00.800] thousands of years. We just want [01:32:05.120] peace. [01:32:06.159] >> Wow. [01:32:06.480] >> We don’t want to be known. We don’t want [01:32:08.960] anything else. Just live out our lives, [01:32:12.800] not as slaves. And uh and he said that [01:32:16.239] they have an underground [01:32:18.400] railroad, what I would call an [01:32:20.400] underground railroad that helps them [01:32:22.560] with it. But he said uh we’re very [01:32:25.600] afraid of that [01:32:28.000] other wedge in the DNA test. And so I [01:32:32.400] went and asked Linda [01:32:34.480] and uh I said, “Is anybody studying that [01:32:37.520] other thing?” And she said, “You know, [01:32:39.920] anybody in the government studying [01:32:41.280] that?” And she said, “Oh yeah.” And she [01:32:43.040] named off four people right there. I [01:32:45.120] mean, she knew the answer right there. [01:32:47.520] And uh so you know, um whether it’s true [01:32:52.239] or not, I don’t know, but it was an [01:32:53.920] incident that happened to me in a [01:32:55.199] parking lot. [01:32:56.239] >> Wow. That is an angle I have can [01:32:58.480] honestly say I’ve never considered that [01:33:00.560] if if there was [01:33:01.840] >> No, I hadn’t neither. I had neither. [01:33:04.320] >> Yeah. So, so are you so so to make sure [01:33:07.199] I I I followed. So, so you’re saying [01:33:10.080] that what we are perceiving to be an [01:33:13.360] advanced presence could actually be [01:33:15.760] humans that escaped from Anunnaki. [01:33:20.239] Or or am I misinterpreting that? [01:33:22.000] >> That’s not what I’m saying. [01:33:23.520] >> Okay. Okay. Okay. I’m saying that he [01:33:26.400] told me that they come back here to [01:33:33.120] be sla to do the slave labor of the ETSs [01:33:36.719] that come back like the um [01:33:39.440] >> humans that I saw at the [01:33:41.120] >> Yeah. uh Mount Zeal and all that doing [01:33:43.520] their work and all that [01:33:45.120] >> and that every now and then one of them [01:33:47.360] was able to escape [01:33:50.560] but after all these centuries [01:33:53.600] they’ve changed you know in some way he [01:33:58.080] didn’t say how but he said you know [01:34:00.639] there’s been changes in us and he said [01:34:03.520] we just don’t want to be discovered we [01:34:05.520] don’t want anything we don’t we just [01:34:08.800] want to live free in peace wild [01:34:11.280] >> for the rest of your lives and that’s [01:34:12.639] it. [01:34:14.239] >> Thanks for [01:34:15.360] >> I was gonna say thanks for bringing the [01:34:16.719] 8200 stuff back up because there was a [01:34:18.560] question I’ve been wanting to ask you on [01:34:20.000] that. Um you said I think on a podcast [01:34:22.960] you did with Jeffrey Michionlo that we [01:34:25.520] had gotten feedback about one of the [01:34:28.080] sites, but I don’t think you ever [01:34:29.440] elaborated on what you meant by that. [01:34:31.600] >> Um actually it was sort of feedback. Um, [01:34:35.120] Skip called a friend of his who works [01:34:38.560] there in Northern Australia. [01:34:41.600] >> Yeah. [01:34:42.159] >> And uh just was talking to him about it. [01:34:46.480] Well, was talking to him about [01:34:48.000] everything and said, “You know, anything [01:34:50.480] going on around there that is of note.” [01:34:53.920] And the guy said, “Nothing whatever. [01:34:56.480] This the most boring job I’ve ever had. [01:34:58.719] If it weren’t for all those UFOs flying [01:35:00.800] around that mountain out there, we [01:35:02.320] >> Yeah. wouldn’t do anything, you know. [01:35:04.719] Yeah. [01:35:05.040] >> So, that was what we took as feedback. [01:35:07.679] Yeah. [01:35:08.719] >> Yeah. That’s interesting. I do I do [01:35:10.480] recall hearing that story. Um, so so [01:35:13.600] like I mentioned, I am really into not [01:35:17.199] even just like the contemporary sort of [01:35:20.239] esoteric stuff, but the ancient esoteric [01:35:23.280] stuff. like I’m very into particularly [01:35:25.840] like um [01:35:27.600] >> you know ancient Greek hermetic platonic [01:35:31.280] type stuff and with that you you start [01:35:34.320] to you start to get this [01:35:37.040] metaphysical worldview that doesn’t [01:35:40.480] sound that different from what we’re [01:35:43.280] talking about except for that these [01:35:45.679] beings that they’re often interacting [01:35:48.000] with you know these like you know [01:35:50.000] whether they’re yogic sages or platonic [01:35:52.800] sages ages, they they conceive of these [01:35:55.120] consciousnesses as spiritual, right? And [01:35:57.920] then later on in the sort of like [01:35:59.520] Judeo-Christian [01:36:01.280] uh millu, you know, we start to use [01:36:03.120] words that we’re all familiar with like [01:36:05.120] like angels and demons and whatever and [01:36:08.239] it changes depending on the cultural [01:36:10.719] context. H [01:36:12.159] >> have you attempted to navigate [01:36:17.520] spiritual sorts of consciousnesses? Do [01:36:20.080] do you have opinions on on that and if [01:36:23.280] that’s a a a reality that can be [01:36:26.320] accessed through this method? [01:36:28.639] >> Well, yeah, that’s that’s obviously of [01:36:32.159] personal interest to me uh especially [01:36:35.040] after that [01:36:36.719] >> uh one session that I did. [01:36:39.120] >> But um and also I am a Methodist [01:36:42.960] minister [01:36:44.560] preacher. I didn’t know that. I didn’t [01:36:45.840] know And um and so you know the religion [01:36:50.960] has always been important to me and um [01:36:56.639] uh people ask me you know how can you be [01:36:59.119] Christian and a psychic too and [01:37:03.679] my honest answer is if God gives you a [01:37:07.679] gift [01:37:09.440] and you refuse to use it you’ve just [01:37:12.480] hidden your light under a bushel like [01:37:14.400] Jesus good and that’s the sin. [01:37:17.360] >> Yeah. [01:37:17.679] >> If God gave you a gift, use it [01:37:20.080] >> for sure. [01:37:20.719] >> Do some good with it, you know. So, um [01:37:24.239] anyway, um [01:37:27.040] yeah, I’ve done um quite a bit on the [01:37:31.360] spiritual realm [01:37:33.360] and um I find it just um [01:37:40.880] true. [01:37:42.480] I don’t find anything [01:37:44.960] exciting or [01:37:48.000] all inspiring about it. We have a spirit [01:37:50.639] within us. Um and [01:37:55.119] um I have come to believe in the [01:37:58.560] possibility of reincarnation. [01:38:00.960] >> Yeah. [01:38:01.679] >> Believe very strongly in in that [01:38:03.600] possibility. Uh I was asked to do a um [01:38:08.080] series of [01:38:10.000] targets one time. Um, I didn’t know I [01:38:13.760] was following people through death and [01:38:15.440] out the other side. And uh, what I found [01:38:19.760] was that some people [01:38:23.520] go to what I would call heaven, some [01:38:25.840] people go to what I would call hell, [01:38:28.400] some people just quit existing, [01:38:31.199] and some people reincarnate. [01:38:34.239] And so the possibilities seem to be [01:38:37.600] there. [01:38:39.119] And the [01:38:42.000] my my feeling has not been, you know, [01:38:46.239] that you’re wrong if you believe this, [01:38:48.159] that, and the other. My feeling has been [01:38:51.199] that you’re wrong if you believe that [01:38:53.119] your belief is the only way. [01:38:55.600] >> Yeah. Yeah. I’m glad to hear that. I’m [01:38:58.080] glad to hear that. Um, yeah, that’s one [01:39:00.400] of those like you find reincarnation [01:39:04.080] in practically every spiritual [01:39:06.880] tradition, mystical tradition up up to a [01:39:09.360] point, even early Christianity. I mean, [01:39:11.679] this was part of a lot of the early [01:39:13.679] Christian beliefs. It’s it’s very [01:39:16.480] present in in ancient Greek, you know, [01:39:18.800] all the way back to uh Plato’s uh [01:39:21.440] republic, the myth of there’s this whole [01:39:24.000] story about the afterlife and [01:39:26.159] reincarnating and all, you know, it’s [01:39:29.440] it’s all over. So, yeah, that that’s [01:39:31.679] always been something that I’ve had [01:39:33.360] trouble discarding as well that I that I [01:39:36.000] take pretty seriously. you know this [01:39:37.920] idea that [01:39:38.960] >> you know when you see these same and and [01:39:41.760] that’s really one of the things that [01:39:42.719] opened my mind to a lot of sigh stuff [01:39:44.880] out of body stuff is that hey you look [01:39:47.840] into yogic traditions it’s there you [01:39:49.760] look into ancient Greek and uh Egyptian [01:39:52.560] traditions it’s there so it’s it’s [01:39:55.119] really hard to see these things across [01:39:57.920] cultures and then just sort of like [01:39:59.600] eliminate them as if we we know better [01:40:02.480] than they did so yeah [01:40:04.719] >> one of the one of the exercises is at [01:40:07.119] Monroe that they had for us was to go [01:40:11.119] into the check unit, get, you know, [01:40:13.679] click in [01:40:15.040] >> and go back through to see if you’ve had [01:40:18.320] past lives. [01:40:19.440] >> Oh, really? [01:40:20.800] >> Yeah. I didn’t make it. [01:40:22.000] >> I don’t know if they do that anymore, [01:40:23.199] but [01:40:23.600] >> yeah, maybe in they have so many [01:40:24.880] different uh retreats and I’ve only done [01:40:27.440] >> Oh, yeah. [01:40:28.080] >> Gateway, so who knows what they do in in [01:40:30.000] some of the But that’s that sounds like [01:40:31.520] something they would do for sure. [01:40:33.040] >> Yeah. Um, [01:40:35.040] what what haven’t we talked Well, one of [01:40:37.040] the things I really wanted to ask you [01:40:39.199] about and I get that maybe navigating [01:40:42.159] this might require generalities, but um [01:40:46.560] I have such a hard time believing that, [01:40:49.119] you know, post mid9s [01:40:52.960] uh the government, three-letter [01:40:54.960] agencies, the intelligence realm just wa [01:40:59.440] wash their hands of of Sai, wash their [01:41:02.320] hands of remote viewing and and even [01:41:04.239] some of the other things we didn’t talk [01:41:05.600] about like you talk about remote [01:41:06.960] influencing, you talk about um other PK [01:41:10.000] related things that you [01:41:11.280] >> Oh, yeah. [01:41:12.480] >> saw or or know existed during your time [01:41:15.199] in the military. [01:41:17.840] >> As far as the end of the unit, I have [01:41:20.239] some pat answers that I give everyone. [01:41:23.679] Okay. One is when you retire, they quit [01:41:26.800] telling you secrets. [01:41:28.480] >> So, I don’t know. Okay. Uh the other is [01:41:33.040] one of the others is that I hope they [01:41:37.920] really didn’t um disband the whole [01:41:41.280] thing. I hope it just once again went [01:41:44.719] under an eighth name that nobody knew [01:41:47.440] about because it went through seven [01:41:49.440] different [01:41:51.199] times when it was disbanded completely [01:41:53.920] and the next day we would go back to [01:41:55.600] work and say, “Oh, you’re in a different [01:41:57.760] project now.” you know, and uh so I’m [01:42:01.520] hoping they didn’t disband it because we [01:42:04.480] did a lot of good, a lot of good. And um [01:42:09.119] the government would be stupid to [01:42:12.000] disband it. [01:42:15.040] But then that brings up the question, [01:42:18.560] does our government ever do anything [01:42:20.320] stupid? [01:42:22.800] And I know the answer. That’s one I know [01:42:25.440] the answer to, [01:42:26.560] >> right? Yeah. Of course. [01:42:29.040] Yeah. [01:42:30.320] >> Um, one of the popular theories of [01:42:32.800] course is well, you know, one theory and [01:42:34.560] and I think Skip Atwater said something [01:42:36.560] to this effect on a podcast. I think he [01:42:38.960] said something to the effect of he was [01:42:40.320] aware of other similar projects and [01:42:42.880] other agencies that and almost like that [01:42:45.280] that almost like your project was sort [01:42:48.000] of like the sacrificial lamb that was [01:42:50.320] publicly like [01:42:51.840] >> I firmly believe that. Yeah. [01:42:55.119] >> Yeah. [01:42:55.520] >> Very interesting. The the other I think [01:42:58.400] we were there to be thrown to the wolves [01:43:00.239] if ever it came out. Yeah. [01:43:04.880] >> Do you have any sense of why that why [01:43:06.560] that was why why you guys? [01:43:09.040] >> Uh to protect the deeper projects. [01:43:11.920] >> Um one thing we were never allowed to do [01:43:15.199] active mental work [01:43:17.440] active mental work like PK or [01:43:19.280] influencing or anything like that. There [01:43:21.840] was a strict I mean strict really strict [01:43:24.719] law against it. We were never allowed to [01:43:28.639] uh remote view US citizens [01:43:32.400] without congressional approval meeting [01:43:36.080] all the requirements of presidential [01:43:38.560] order 12333. [01:43:41.199] And um so [01:43:44.639] you know [01:43:46.400] was somebody else doing it? [01:43:50.719] I would think so. [01:43:52.800] >> Yeah. Um, one time, uh, when I was first [01:43:55.920] there, uh, they knew, uh, General [01:43:59.600] Stubble had told Brian, the director, [01:44:02.800] that I had been doing PK. And so Brian [01:44:07.199] called me in and he said, “We don’t do [01:44:09.280] that here. We don’t do active mental [01:44:11.280] work.” And he read me the riot act on [01:44:15.280] it. Uh afterwards I was out in the desk [01:44:21.679] area, you know, setting up my desk and [01:44:23.760] all. Skip came by and he said, “Uh I I [01:44:27.920] guess Brian told you that um we don’t do [01:44:31.119] that kind of work here.” And I said, [01:44:32.320] “Yeah.” And he said, “Absolutely true. [01:44:36.159] We don’t do that kind of work here.” H [01:44:40.639] >> and walked off [01:44:43.440] >> and uh [01:44:45.840] at that point [01:44:48.239] I’ve thought many times I could remote [01:44:50.159] view it if they are doing PK and [01:44:53.520] influencing and all that and I keep [01:44:56.560] thinking do I really want to stick my [01:44:58.639] hand into that hornets’s nest? I don’t [01:45:01.040] think so. [01:45:02.239] >> Yeah. [01:45:03.199] >> You know if they’re doing it I don’t [01:45:05.280] need to know you. [01:45:07.199] >> Yeah. that that starts to get into the [01:45:08.960] realm of the sort of black arts a bit, [01:45:11.040] you know, when you start when you I [01:45:13.280] mean, [01:45:14.159] >> of course, you know, it’s been it’s been [01:45:16.080] speculated. Could you? And this is [01:45:17.760] something that I believe is in uh I [01:45:20.239] don’t know if it’s a DIA document, but I [01:45:22.239] remember when I was doing research for a [01:45:23.840] video I put out a while ago. You know, [01:45:25.920] one of the justifications for having [01:45:28.000] this unit existing, you know, they lay [01:45:30.400] out all the things that they’re worried [01:45:31.920] that the Soviets are doing. And one of [01:45:34.239] them is is like essentially like remote [01:45:36.880] assassinations. It’s like remote psychic [01:45:39.600] assassination. Uh the Russians called it [01:45:42.320] don gypnos [01:45:44.880] >> uh which is uh remote hypnosis [01:45:49.440] and uh they were evidently extremely [01:45:52.480] good at it [01:45:55.600] and and I I I of course don’t know but [01:45:59.199] you know if I’m a skeptic sitting here [01:46:00.880] hearing that I’d be like come on like if [01:46:02.320] you could just remotely kill someone [01:46:04.639] that easily there’d be you know world [01:46:08.000] leaders bodies just dropping left and [01:46:09.920] right? You know, it’s got it’s can’t it [01:46:12.239] can’t be possible. What would your [01:46:13.920] retort to that? [01:46:15.119] >> It’s possible. Um [01:46:18.159] I want to clear up one thing. Okay. [01:46:20.560] >> Yeah. [01:46:21.360] >> I did kill the computers. I did not I [01:46:24.960] did not kill the goat. [01:46:27.199] >> All right. Yeah. Yeah. [01:46:28.159] >> That that was another sergeant who [01:46:30.000] killed the goat. I didn’t do it. The [01:46:33.199] movie shows Lynn Cassidy killing the [01:46:36.239] goat. That wasn’t me. Okay. [01:46:40.560] But this did happen. [01:46:42.960] >> Yeah, it happened. Yeah. Mhm. [01:46:45.600] >> Do you think you need to be [01:46:48.320] near the target to have that kind of an [01:46:50.480] impact or Wow. [01:46:51.840] >> No. Um and the thing is it’s [01:46:56.159] frighteningly easy to do. [01:46:58.960] >> Wow. [01:47:00.080] >> Yeah. [01:47:01.520] >> That is frightening. And it does leave [01:47:03.760] me with the question of you know what if [01:47:07.440] you know the the other thing that just [01:47:09.679] really strains the imagination is that [01:47:12.560] if this is happening and if there is [01:47:14.560] this whole covert world of sigh [01:47:18.560] operations you know not not scops in the [01:47:20.800] psychological way but sigh psi [01:47:23.440] >> is that what if there is just a whole [01:47:26.960] hidden realm of [01:47:29.920] psychic warfare happening behind the [01:47:31.840] scenes all the time that the public has [01:47:34.400] no idea about. [01:47:36.639] >> Well, the public doesn’t need to know. [01:47:41.679] >> Yeah, [01:47:42.080] >> that brings up a that brings up a point. [01:47:44.320] Okay. Um, [01:47:48.320] they say, “Oh, you don’t have a need to [01:47:50.400] know, right?” [01:47:52.560] And somebody says, “Well, I do need to [01:47:54.719] know.” [01:47:56.320] Okay, here again, you’ve got parts of [01:47:59.600] speech. [01:48:01.119] I need to know is a verb. I need to know [01:48:04.560] it. When they say you don’t have a need [01:48:09.520] to know, that’s a noun. [01:48:11.760] >> Mhm. [01:48:12.239] >> Okay. The noun is a noun phrase. Need to [01:48:16.000] know. Okay. [01:48:19.360] A need to know is a status [01:48:22.800] saying that the government has a need [01:48:26.159] for you to know something. [01:48:28.560] >> Right? So when they say you don’t have a [01:48:32.000] need to know, [01:48:34.080] they’re not talking about your need at [01:48:35.920] all. They don’t care about your need, [01:48:39.199] >> right? [01:48:39.600] >> They’re saying the government doesn’t [01:48:41.920] have a [01:48:43.760] need to know that we’re going to grant [01:48:45.520] you because we need for you to know. [01:48:49.360] >> Yeah. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Some Yeah. [01:48:53.360] Those are some fun semantics. Um so so [01:48:56.960] the the other route that you always hear [01:48:58.639] about this and there seems to be some [01:49:00.239] evidence for is that the the government [01:49:04.320] proper sort of does wash their hands of [01:49:06.639] it and it goes into the private realm [01:49:09.040] and there’s like some I mean there’s you [01:49:11.280] can see um [01:49:13.360] >> there’s correspondence on archive.org [01:49:16.159] with sic. [01:49:19.440] >> Yeah. [01:49:20.560] >> Stuff like that. Well, um when they [01:49:23.199] announced that they were going to [01:49:24.480] disband the Stargate unit, um [01:49:30.400] I was told that um they have a way to [01:49:35.119] civilianize it and uh farm it out to a [01:49:39.119] civilian company like they’re doing with [01:49:40.880] the uh ET material like they’re doing [01:49:44.239] with the Mars projects and and all this. [01:49:47.040] You put it out to a civilian [01:49:49.520] corporation, [01:49:51.520] classify it so that they can’t talk [01:49:53.840] about it, and then anybody comes to the [01:49:57.199] government, and the government says, [01:49:58.639] “We’re not doing that.” [01:50:00.159] >> Right? [01:50:01.520] >> You know, so it’s a it’s a way to get [01:50:04.480] away from the Freedom of Information [01:50:06.239] Act. [01:50:07.679] >> It’s very convenient. It’s very [01:50:09.760] convenient. Um, [01:50:12.960] do you think that I mean we’re we’re in [01:50:15.600] deep in the realm of speculation, but [01:50:17.520] Well, okay. So, to take it slightly out [01:50:19.520] of the realm of speculation, are have [01:50:21.280] you by chance seen um the UFO [01:50:23.679] whistleblower Jake Barber and what he’s [01:50:25.600] been saying about psionics? [01:50:27.600] >> No, I haven’t. [01:50:28.400] >> Oh, really? You I think you would find [01:50:30.719] this very fascinating. So, so he’s a [01:50:32.719] former [01:50:33.360] >> I guess about about four years ago, I [01:50:36.400] cut off the TV. I’ve been writing books. [01:50:39.520] I’ve been studying. I’ve been doing [01:50:41.920] other stuff. And uh [01:50:45.119] I’m virtually totally unaware of what’s [01:50:48.320] going on in the world. [01:50:49.920] >> Gotcha. [01:50:50.400] >> In the world outside my horizon. Yeah. [01:50:53.679] >> Well, well, let me let me uh let me spin [01:50:55.679] a yarn for you and I and I’ll leave this [01:50:57.520] out here as a a tempting rabbit hole for [01:50:59.520] you to follow up on. So, so this former [01:51:02.880] uh tier one operator, Jake Barber, Air [01:51:06.239] Force guy, comes public and does a big [01:51:09.840] interview and says that he was [01:51:12.320] personally involved in crash retrieval. [01:51:14.880] So, you know, unbeknownst to him, like [01:51:17.520] he was he would be told, “Hey, you got [01:51:20.480] to go pick something with your [01:51:22.080] helicopter out here.” [01:51:24.560] >> Did this hundreds and hundreds of times. [01:51:27.520] He had a couple of occasions that where [01:51:30.719] those targets ended up being these like [01:51:33.360] HVT, you know, highv value targets that [01:51:35.679] were when he arrived at them, it was [01:51:38.400] extremely obvious that they were [01:51:39.840] anomalous. They were not [01:51:41.920] >> I’ve been to one of those I’ve been to [01:51:43.360] one of those places and seen them. Yeah. [01:51:45.119] Mhm. [01:51:45.599] >> Really? Really? [01:51:46.880] >> Um, so I want I want to hear that. But [01:51:49.920] to finish it that story, he says that [01:51:54.159] there was essentially he learned later a [01:51:56.560] whole technique for basically summoning [01:51:59.599] these things. And part of the technique [01:52:02.159] is what he called psionic, meaning that [01:52:04.960] there was a team of guys basically who [01:52:08.239] could put out a sort of psychic call to [01:52:12.239] make these things show up. And then um [01:52:15.440] these aerospace contractors basically [01:52:18.080] you know all the big ones or the the [01:52:20.239] obvious ones apparently had protocols [01:52:23.440] for for either inviting or compelling [01:52:26.560] these things to land so that they could [01:52:29.040] take them. Um so Barber by blowing the [01:52:34.400] whistle on this is he was saying that he [01:52:37.920] wants to basically have disclosure [01:52:41.280] through a private version of showing hey [01:52:44.719] I can me with a team of psionic guys can [01:52:47.679] actually do this exact same thing [01:52:49.760] >> and and therefore we don’t need uh [01:52:52.800] people to come forward from these [01:52:54.239] companies because I can show you that we [01:52:56.639] can do this. So [01:52:58.719] >> he up until recently, apparently this [01:53:00.960] just ended and everybody’s kind of like [01:53:03.199] scratching their head on this because we [01:53:05.040] didn’t exactly get uh concrete [01:53:07.199] disclosure out of their project, but [01:53:09.119] they did do they did do this apparently [01:53:11.760] to some degree. Um so yeah, if this is [01:53:14.480] all new to you, then um I’ll I’ll [01:53:17.040] definitely share the links with you. But [01:53:18.639] you said you’ve been at one of these [01:53:19.840] sites. Can you is this something you can [01:53:22.800] >> um [01:53:24.480] I was um [01:53:27.280] at a um [01:53:29.520] I was away on a mission one time. Okay. [01:53:32.800] And u I was at this place and I was in [01:53:36.239] the cafeteria and u I looked up and here [01:53:40.880] is an army buddy I knew years and years [01:53:45.280] and years ago. [01:53:47.520] He said, “What are you doing here?” [01:53:50.560] And I said, “Well, I can’t tell you.” I [01:53:53.440] said, “What are you doing here?” And he [01:53:54.639] said, “Well, I can’t tell you.” And so, [01:53:57.199] we got to talking and he finally said, [01:53:58.880] “What’s your clearance?” Now, this was [01:54:01.440] after my military service. Okay. After [01:54:04.320] my military service, my clearance [01:54:09.040] went skyhigh. [01:54:12.000] Um, my clearance in the military [01:54:15.119] service, [01:54:16.800] the top I had was top secret. Um, it [01:54:20.560] went to secret while in the remote [01:54:22.719] viewing unit. When I got out, I got a [01:54:26.320] job that, um, gave me TSI [01:54:31.760] SCOP, which is TS, top secret. ESI is [01:54:36.960] extremely sensitive information. [01:54:40.080] SCOP is SIO P strategic integrated [01:54:44.719] operational program [01:54:47.440] and uh that’s [01:54:50.960] rarely ever given to anybody. [01:54:52.960] >> Wow. [01:54:53.440] >> And um what it says is you have [01:54:57.119] extremely sensitive information top [01:54:59.920] secret at the top secret level and [01:55:04.480] you’re cleared for any government [01:55:06.320] agency. [01:55:08.159] Okay. And so I was doing some special [01:55:10.880] work, but um [01:55:14.239] uh [01:55:16.080] forget where I was going with this. Oh, [01:55:18.239] I was at this um this installation [01:55:22.320] and u I I let him know that, you know, [01:55:26.960] and he said, “Well, maybe I can tell [01:55:28.719] you.” And so he [01:55:31.840] um [01:55:33.520] had had me checked and they verified my [01:55:38.159] clearance. [01:55:39.679] And so he took me to where he worked and [01:55:42.320] it was his hanger where they had midair [01:55:45.360] collisions and there was airplane junk [01:55:48.400] all over the place. They were putting [01:55:49.760] the pieces back together again. And we [01:55:52.880] were walking along through this hanger [01:55:55.679] and there was this one pile of debris [01:55:58.800] there and there was a control panel in [01:56:02.080] it. [01:56:04.800] This goes off on another thing. I had [01:56:07.840] had a previous abduction. [01:56:10.880] Okay. Really? Before going into service. [01:56:13.760] And um before going into service the [01:56:16.719] second time, I had had this abduction [01:56:19.199] and um I had had a chance to see the [01:56:22.400] control panel of the UFO. [01:56:25.040] And as we walked past it, I said, [01:56:28.639] “That’s out of a UFO.” And it just [01:56:31.440] echoed in that chamber. [01:56:34.000] this uh this um colonel, [01:56:39.199] I think he was a captain, this captain [01:56:41.599] came running out of an office and just [01:56:44.000] gave me the bums rush out of there and [01:56:46.800] you know, but uh I mean I recognized it [01:56:50.480] for what it is because I had seen it [01:56:53.119] before [01:56:54.320] >> and so that’s why [01:56:58.800] that thing of putting midair collisions [01:57:02.080] back together [01:57:04.080] became so secret in that place because [01:57:06.480] they were also having midair collisions [01:57:08.880] with UFOs. Yeah. [01:57:10.320] >> Wow. Yeah. Yeah. This is one of the [01:57:12.639] things that you hear about in some of [01:57:14.239] these like testimonies before Congress [01:57:17.199] that have been going on is that, you [01:57:19.119] know, you have like Ryan Graves who’s [01:57:20.800] this fighter pilot who’s come forward [01:57:22.800] and said, “We would encounter these [01:57:24.800] things all the time and we were very [01:57:27.040] we’ve come very close to colliding with [01:57:29.040] things numerous times.” And it sounds [01:57:31.840] like they have it sounds like that from [01:57:33.760] what you’re saying they have collided [01:57:35.040] with these things. I I’ve got to ask [01:57:37.040] what what did this control panel look [01:57:39.040] like? [01:57:40.080] >> Um [01:57:42.719] it looks like [01:57:45.760] an impression indentation of a hand. [01:57:49.920] Okay. with, excuse me, with [01:57:54.560] holes [01:57:56.320] in the board and then some um holes [01:58:00.639] going out to the side. [01:58:03.199] And um [01:58:05.440] you control the thing by having your [01:58:08.480] hand there. [01:58:10.719] And the holes out to the side [01:58:14.239] have sort of indicator lights in them. [01:58:17.280] And if you [01:58:20.159] get off, if something goes ary, the [01:58:23.440] light works out toward the edge. [01:58:26.639] And uh so then you have to use those [01:58:30.080] holes to get the light back toward the [01:58:32.719] center before you’re stabilized again [01:58:36.000] and all that. And that seems to be the [01:58:38.960] way it was on Well, that’s the way it [01:58:42.080] was on the ship that where I was [01:58:44.480] abducted. Yeah. [01:58:46.000] >> Wow. [01:58:47.119] Well, now I’ve got to ask too about that [01:58:48.880] experience. What if if you if you feel [01:58:51.199] open to sharing that, I would love to [01:58:53.040] hear that story. [01:58:54.000] >> Uh, I was a Methodist minister in um [01:58:59.199] an East Texas town, tiny little town, [01:59:02.560] and the parsonage was a good quarter of [01:59:04.960] a mile off the road uh off the highway. [01:59:08.960] And uh one night [01:59:11.520] uh the Methodists [01:59:14.080] move their ministers almost every year [01:59:16.960] to new churches. So they rotate them. [01:59:19.679] >> Okay. [01:59:20.000] >> And called circuit writers. [01:59:21.920] >> And um uh this is before you get good [01:59:25.440] enough to have a church where you’re [01:59:26.960] stabilized at. And um so my family had [01:59:31.599] already moved and I was packing up the [01:59:34.719] house and um had everything in the in [01:59:39.119] the U-Haul [01:59:40.800] and uh [01:59:43.040] I put out a pallet and laid down on the [01:59:45.040] floor in the living room and I heard [01:59:48.159] something land in the backyard [01:59:51.199] and it sounded [01:59:55.520] not unlike a helicopter. [01:59:58.800] But it you could tell it wasn’t a [02:00:00.400] helicopter. [02:00:01.760] >> So I started to get up and go see what [02:00:03.679] it was and I couldn’t move. [02:00:07.360] And I was wide awake. I mean this was [02:00:09.679] not a dream or anything like that. I was [02:00:11.360] wide awake. I was frozen. I couldn’t [02:00:13.040] move. And u I heard [02:00:17.119] somebody coming through the grass around [02:00:20.400] the side of the house to look into the [02:00:23.679] front room window. [02:00:25.920] The next thing I knew, I was sitting in [02:00:29.360] a row of people. There was this old old [02:00:33.679] woman beside me and uh a couple of empty [02:00:37.840] seats and a window and there was a row [02:00:41.840] of people already filled up behind. And [02:00:45.119] uh whenever I fly, [02:00:48.800] I [02:00:50.480] don’t like being in enclosed places. [02:00:52.880] >> Yeah. So I always get a window seat on [02:00:55.280] the plane. And so this [02:00:58.800] tall, extremely pale being came by, just [02:01:03.520] muscled up like Arnold Schwarzenegger [02:01:05.520] and all that. [02:01:06.320] >> Okay. [02:01:06.800] >> And um and so I said, “Excuse me, can I [02:01:11.199] sit by the window?” [02:01:13.679] And he got this look of fear on his [02:01:16.000] face. I’m in absolute terror that [02:01:19.280] somebody had come too cuz everybody was [02:01:22.080] just frozen. And so he turned run out of [02:01:25.360] the room. [02:01:27.360] Pretty soon a little gray with three of [02:01:30.639] these big tall white [02:01:33.760] um muscled up guys came kind of huddled [02:01:38.320] behind this little bitty gray and uh the [02:01:41.679] gray started talking to me and I started [02:01:43.840] sort of phasing out but I catch myself [02:01:45.920] every time and so finally the gray said [02:01:49.280] well you know [02:01:52.400] come with me [02:01:54.400] and so he took me up front he was the [02:01:57.199] pilot and the other guys got to work [02:02:00.480] with the equipment or whatever it was [02:02:03.840] and u they would lift off [02:02:07.119] uh sit down somewhere. They would go out [02:02:10.639] and evidently they were picking up [02:02:12.320] people, filling up the thing and he was [02:02:16.800] um he was very [02:02:20.080] free with the information everything [02:02:22.000] else [02:02:23.280] >> and um uh we talked very friendly [02:02:28.239] and um so anyway he said okay there’s a [02:02:31.119] long jump [02:02:32.800] and uh and so [02:02:36.960] this long jump We left the earth [02:02:41.520] and uh there was just nothing outside [02:02:45.280] the window and all that, you know, [02:02:46.880] darkness, stars you could see. And so he [02:02:50.239] was working this thing and I said, “Can [02:02:52.159] I try that?” He said, “No, your hands [02:02:54.560] are too small.” And I have very large [02:02:57.920] hands. So he had me put my hand up. He [02:03:01.360] put his hand up on mine and they were [02:03:03.840] basically the same size. Now I was [02:03:06.880] kneeling down at the console. [02:03:09.679] He was standing and we were eye level. [02:03:13.679] Okay. And so but his hands were my size. [02:03:18.080] So he said, “Well, I’ll let you try it.” [02:03:22.000] So he let me try it. And he stood over [02:03:24.239] me like you’re, you know, I’m going to [02:03:27.440] cr I’m going to catch you if you start [02:03:29.280] crashing us. And he was showing me how [02:03:32.000] the thing worked and all that. And uh [02:03:35.679] when we got to wherever it was, well, it [02:03:38.800] didn’t let me do that for very long, you [02:03:41.119] know. And uh when we got to wherever we [02:03:44.159] were going, [02:03:45.920] um they landed. [02:03:48.800] There were two other crafts already [02:03:51.280] landed and there were people filing in [02:03:53.760] and out to the different crafts. And uh [02:03:57.760] came our turn and he had me go sit down [02:04:00.560] with the people. And as we filed out, he [02:04:04.480] grabbed me and he said, “You don’t want [02:04:06.000] to go up there where they’re going.” [02:04:08.480] They went up this hill to a pavilion. [02:04:12.400] It’s very dark, but very warm. And um [02:04:17.679] and from the sounds that came out of [02:04:20.080] that pavilion, I’m glad he stopped me. [02:04:22.320] But we sat on the hillside here um just [02:04:26.320] talking and all. [02:04:28.560] He um this is all in uh Jim Mars’s um [02:04:34.560] book, Alien Agenda, by the way. [02:04:36.880] >> Okay, [02:04:37.280] >> Jim got the whole story. And um so at [02:04:41.920] one point he said, “I’ve got somebody [02:04:44.800] you need to talk to.” And uh he went and [02:04:48.560] got this other gray that came up, sat [02:04:52.239] down on the hill beside me and put his [02:04:54.880] hand up and he said, “Put your hand up.” [02:04:58.080] When I did, he put his hand on the back [02:05:00.080] of mine and then started talking to me [02:05:04.400] and to this day I still don’t remember [02:05:07.599] what it was. [02:05:08.560] >> Oh no. [02:05:09.119] >> You know. [02:05:09.679] >> Yeah. [02:05:10.159] >> Uh and so anyway, the next thing I knew, [02:05:13.520] the people were coming down from that [02:05:15.119] pavilion. I fell back in line with them. [02:05:18.560] And uh I finally remembered years later [02:05:22.639] that when I got back on, I turned to the [02:05:26.080] gray and I said, “I would like to [02:05:27.520] remember this.” And he said, “You [02:05:28.960] won’t.” [02:05:31.840] Uh the next morning, I found myself at [02:05:35.360] the back window [02:05:38.000] of the house looking out at the ground. [02:05:43.199] I had no idea. [02:05:45.840] I thought I must have been sleepwalking, [02:05:48.960] totally confused, all this other stuff. [02:05:52.239] And so I just wandered around this empty [02:05:55.599] house, and finally I remembered, “Oh, [02:05:57.360] yeah, I’m moving today.” [02:06:00.239] >> Yeah. [02:06:00.719] >> So I rolled up the little pallet, threw [02:06:04.960] it into the U-Haul, and drove off. And [02:06:08.639] uh I had the feeling I’d forgotten [02:06:11.040] something. [02:06:12.880] For the next 25 years, it got worse and [02:06:15.920] worse and worse and uh I couldn’t leave [02:06:19.199] the house without going back and [02:06:20.880] checking what have I forgotten. I [02:06:22.719] couldn’t never forgot anything, you [02:06:25.119] know. [02:06:25.360] >> Yeah. [02:06:26.000] >> But um one day we were headed for church [02:06:29.840] on a Sunday. I was already in the [02:06:31.599] military remote viewing unit and um I I [02:06:36.480] kept going back and back and my wife [02:06:39.840] finally just started picking at me. She [02:06:42.639] said, “Did you check the basement?” I [02:06:44.320] said, “I checked the basement. Did you [02:06:45.599] check the kitchen? I checked.” She said, [02:06:47.840] “Did you check the backyard?” [02:06:50.960] >> And when she said that, the whole thing [02:06:53.760] came back except what that second said [02:06:57.440] person said to me. And uh and it all [02:07:01.119] came flooding back. I didn’t believe it. [02:07:03.520] I thought, “This is total fantasy. This [02:07:06.560] is crazy. I was never abducted.” And um [02:07:10.480] and so I I mean I sat down in the front [02:07:15.040] steps. I I just [02:07:17.840] didn’t know what to do and all that. [02:07:19.679] >> Yeah. [02:07:20.079] >> And I still didn’t believe it. So the [02:07:22.400] next day, Monday, I went to the military [02:07:25.760] unit and I gave them some coordinates. [02:07:28.639] I said, [02:07:29.679] >> “It’s an event. Describe the event.” [02:07:31.599] They all described it. [02:07:33.679] >> Wow. And uh so [02:07:38.000] um I still didn’t believe it. I thought, [02:07:41.199] well, telepathic overlay, they’re just [02:07:43.920] >> right. [02:07:45.119] >> My my imagination is overruling their [02:07:47.760] viewing, you know. [02:07:49.520] >> Um [02:07:51.440] about two or three weeks later, I found [02:07:53.679] that Ed seemed to have tattled on me to [02:07:57.679] whoever he was [02:08:00.800] working with. And u I was up at the DIA [02:08:04.880] and headed toward the director’s office [02:08:08.239] and two quote men in black stepped out [02:08:12.159] in the hallway, pointed in. [02:08:15.760] I went in, [02:08:18.320] sat down in front of the interrogator. [02:08:21.920] The men in black is an professional [02:08:25.040] interrogator [02:08:26.719] and a person from the unit that hired [02:08:29.119] the professional interrogator and is [02:08:30.960] briefed him on what to do. And uh that [02:08:34.880] person sits over to one side and is [02:08:38.960] never supposed to say anything while the [02:08:41.040] interrogator interrogates. And so he [02:08:44.800] asked me a whole bunch of questions and [02:08:47.040] I thought [02:08:49.040] they’re trying to see if I’m crazy. [02:08:51.280] Yeah. [02:08:52.159] >> But they never ask about anything except [02:08:54.560] the control panel. [02:08:56.239] >> Wow. [02:08:57.760] >> And so [02:08:59.920] the way the the way the interrogator ask [02:09:02.159] it, he’ll have about 10 or 15 questions. [02:09:05.520] He’ll rotate them back and forth and [02:09:07.440] repeat them in different ways to see if [02:09:09.520] you trip yourself up. And so about the [02:09:12.239] third time he asked me on this, I said, [02:09:14.880] “No, let me explain.” And I explained [02:09:18.320] it. And the guy over to the left over [02:09:21.040] there slapped his knee and he said, “So [02:09:24.079] that’s it.” [02:09:26.400] Now, they’re never supposed to say a [02:09:27.920] word. [02:09:30.079] And I looked at the interrogator [02:09:34.239] and I realized [02:09:36.480] he’s got one and doesn’t know how to fly [02:09:38.800] it. [02:09:40.960] And I grinned. [02:09:42.880] And the interrogator, of course, is [02:09:44.560] trained. They never make an a response [02:09:46.560] of any kind. [02:09:48.560] But his his ears just suddenly got beat [02:09:52.400] red and within 15 seconds both of them [02:09:55.840] were up and gone out of the room. I was [02:09:57.679] sitting there by myself. [02:09:59.360] >> Wow. [02:09:59.760] >> And I thought maybe it’s real, you know. [02:10:04.000] >> Wow. [02:10:04.320] >> Well, it was about I guess uh [02:10:08.480] close to a little over half a year [02:10:10.159] later. I was out at this facility, met [02:10:13.440] my old army buddy and uh walked through [02:10:18.000] that hanger and there it was. And I had [02:10:23.040] to admit myself [02:10:26.800] I was abducted. [02:10:29.280] >> It actually happened. [02:10:31.280] >> Um it was years later after I got out of [02:10:34.320] service that I found this um uh [02:10:38.800] hypnotherapist [02:10:40.880] Yeah. [02:10:41.360] >> Who I knew did not believe in UFOs. [02:10:44.800] That was one of my criteria. [02:10:47.360] And so, uh, wouldn’t take it and run and [02:10:51.119] let his illusion affect me. And he put [02:10:55.840] me through the routine. And come to find [02:10:57.840] out, this is in Jim’s book, um, [02:11:03.360] they needed pilots. [02:11:06.400] and I had shown that my hands were good [02:11:09.760] and I was capable of doing it and they [02:11:14.560] had offered me a job [02:11:17.119] and I said well I’ll go you know get my [02:11:20.560] family [02:11:22.079] and he said no you can’t you know [02:11:26.880] and I said well then I won’t take it you [02:11:29.760] know and that’s [02:11:31.920] >> wow [02:11:32.400] >> I got back on the fell in line got back [02:11:35.679] on the ship [02:11:37.280] They said, “Well, you won’t remember [02:11:38.480] it.” But after that time when my wife [02:11:42.320] said, “Uh, you know, did you check the [02:11:45.199] backyard?” And all that came back. [02:11:47.040] >> Yeah. [02:11:48.159] >> I have never once since left the house [02:11:52.400] and felt like I’d forgotten something. [02:11:54.870] [Laughter] [02:11:57.679] >> Well, my friend, I don’t I think we [02:12:00.239] saved the best, wildest tale for last. [02:12:03.760] Unless you’ve got something left in the [02:12:05.280] tank. [02:12:06.079] >> That’s [02:12:06.480] >> That’s a wild one, isn’t it? [02:12:08.000] >> Yeah. [02:12:08.719] >> But anyway, that’s my that’s my [02:12:10.400] abduction experience. And uh [02:12:12.880] >> it did take me 25 years before [02:12:17.599] it all came back. I had I had no [02:12:20.960] recollection, no even thought. And in [02:12:23.760] fact, I really kind of doubted the whole [02:12:29.040] alien abduction stir anyway. [02:12:32.560] >> Sure. Yeah. I mean, it’s just like all [02:12:34.719] this other stuff, right? I mean, it’s [02:12:36.239] like you can’t believe remote viewing is [02:12:37.920] real, then you remote view. You can’t [02:12:39.360] believe out of body experiences are [02:12:41.119] real, and then you have an out-of- body [02:12:42.480] experience. And here I’m sitting I, as [02:12:44.639] far as I know, I’ve never been abducted. [02:12:46.239] Maybe I was one of the anesti [02:12:47.760] anesestized uh mind wiped people, but as [02:12:51.119] far as I know, [02:12:51.679] >> had no idea, [02:12:52.719] >> right? Like, yeah, man. Wow. [02:12:54.400] >> But u I mean, the last thing I wanted [02:12:57.440] was to believe that I had been abducted. [02:12:59.760] I just absolutely not, you know. Yeah. [02:13:03.440] And that’s something you find, right? [02:13:05.040] Like that, you know, a lot of times [02:13:07.760] people who are the victims of abduction, [02:13:11.280] if you want to call it that, [02:13:13.920] are not people who who want to be. And [02:13:16.159] and that’s one of the things that um [02:13:18.239] >> Oh, why am I drawing a blank on his [02:13:19.599] name? The the famous psychiatrist from [02:13:21.840] Harvard who uh [02:13:24.239] >> John Mack, you know, like that’s one of [02:13:26.079] the things that that that convinced him. [02:13:28.159] It’s like these these people are not [02:13:29.920] like attention-seeking [02:13:32.480] nutcases that are that are sharing these [02:13:34.400] abduction stories. Like these people [02:13:36.880] really had an experience. Um, what do [02:13:40.159] you what do you want to leave people [02:13:41.599] with, Lynn? Do you want to leave people [02:13:43.199] with the with that or do you want [02:13:45.440] >> Um, [02:13:47.119] I’m not surprised too much by what the [02:13:49.599] human mind can do anymore, [02:13:52.000] but I will never quit being amazed by [02:13:53.920] it. [02:13:55.360] the human mind. [02:13:57.679] You know, we’ve been at the remote [02:13:59.599] viewing for what, over 40 years now. [02:14:04.000] We’ve gotten it down to where we can do [02:14:07.920] things that appear to be magic. Total [02:14:10.639] magic. Um, you know, draw me the floor [02:14:14.400] plans [02:14:16.800] of a building. In fact, one of my [02:14:19.040] students uh went into a contest and we [02:14:22.400] called it the Joe McMova [02:14:26.480] is having their meeting here, their [02:14:28.560] conference here the first week in [02:14:30.079] September and there’s still openings by [02:14:31.679] the way. Go to erva.org [02:14:34.480] >> and uh and [02:14:38.239] come to it. Yeah. [02:14:39.440] >> Cool. [02:14:39.840] >> Uh but um after all of this time, [02:14:44.719] we’re still in kindergarten. [02:14:47.440] What you can do with the human mind is [02:14:50.159] just [02:14:52.400] beyond amazing. [02:14:54.719] And we’ve got people [02:14:57.040] who are fighting against it. We’ve got [02:14:59.599] people who don’t care about it. And [02:15:02.079] we’ve got people who are training now [02:15:04.800] and they’re doing miraculous things. [02:15:07.440] Bringing missing kids home, you know, [02:15:09.280] helping bring missing kids home, missing [02:15:11.520] soldiers, captured soldiers. uh [02:15:15.520] winning big time at the casinos, things [02:15:20.079] like this. Okay. Um [02:15:23.520] and uh it’s a human ability that seems [02:15:27.840] to be inherent to the human nature. [02:15:31.440] We’ve never found anybody who can’t do [02:15:34.239] it. We have found many people who won’t [02:15:37.440] do it for religious reasons or [02:15:39.920] upbringing or fear or whatever. But uh [02:15:44.560] the future that’s out there [02:15:49.040] is just phenomenal. Um I was telling you [02:15:54.239] before about the u the four different [02:15:57.280] categories of ETS. [02:16:02.480] Did I tell you about that one? [02:16:04.079] >> Um actually no I don’t think you did. [02:16:06.239] >> Oh that’ll be for another time or [02:16:07.920] something. I don’t know. Um [02:16:10.560] >> no the um I was I was asked to do a [02:16:13.679] paper on um compare and contrast [02:16:19.199] human psychic abilities with ET psychic [02:16:23.119] abilities. Well, there’s not us and [02:16:25.119] them. There’s us and them and them and [02:16:26.719] them and them and them and them and [02:16:27.840] them, you know. [02:16:29.040] >> Yeah. And uh so I was given access to [02:16:32.080] grudge papers, blue book papers, other [02:16:36.000] papers that are [02:16:39.120] not generally known to the public and [02:16:41.920] all that of actual at uh abductions and [02:16:46.080] experiences and all that. And um I was [02:16:51.359] able to separate [02:16:54.319] the ETSs [02:16:56.479] psychically into four categories, [02:16:59.599] friends [02:17:01.120] and enemies. [02:17:04.319] In each one of those categories, you [02:17:06.319] have those who are more psychic than we [02:17:08.080] are and those who are equally or less [02:17:10.080] psychic than we are. The friendly ones [02:17:13.920] who are equal or less psychic than we [02:17:17.679] are, they’re here for trade. [02:17:20.399] The unfriendly ones don’t come here [02:17:23.120] except by mistake or accident or [02:17:25.200] whatever. [02:17:26.880] Those who are more psychic than we are [02:17:30.639] and enemies just want us wiped off the [02:17:33.519] planet. They want us dead. Period. [02:17:36.880] The friendly ones who are more psychic [02:17:39.040] than we are want us to develop our [02:17:40.960] psychic abilities. [02:17:42.960] And I understood the [02:17:46.399] two equal or less. I didn’t understand [02:17:49.519] the motivation for the other two the [02:17:52.479] ones who were more psychic. And u one [02:17:56.880] wanted uh incident that I came across in [02:18:00.880] in all the papers. There were these guys [02:18:03.599] standing at the lake and they saw this [02:18:06.880] uh UFO coming over the lake and they [02:18:12.160] were standing there at the shore looking [02:18:14.160] up at it and it came right over them. it [02:18:16.479] stopped and it abducted him [02:18:20.080] and uh so [02:18:25.040] all of a sudden I think from other [02:18:27.200] things I had read it dawned on me [02:18:31.439] they are more psychic than we are can [02:18:33.679] control our minds and all this but they [02:18:36.880] don’t have any range [02:18:39.519] >> with the remote viewing we can see [02:18:41.519] across space and time like we can look [02:18:43.519] across a room [02:18:45.920] And when we get into space, if we have [02:18:48.719] developed our minds to that ability, [02:18:52.479] we are going to be a power in the [02:18:54.960] universe. [02:18:57.040] That’s why our friends want us to do it [02:19:00.399] >> and stay friends with them. That’s [02:19:02.000] >> right. [02:19:02.559] >> That’s why the enemies [02:19:05.280] want us wiped out. [02:19:06.800] >> Wow. [02:19:07.760] >> And that was the paper I turned in and u [02:19:12.639] it got classified. [02:19:15.439] It got [02:19:19.359] it’s probably in that warehouse of [02:19:20.960] Indiana Jones, you know, [02:19:22.479] >> right? Yeah. [02:19:24.639] >> Jones movie. But um [02:19:26.719] >> uh that was the paper I I wrote and [02:19:28.880] found out from [02:19:30.639] >> all of the um information I had been [02:19:33.679] given from those different projects. [02:19:35.599] Yeah. [02:19:37.840] >> Yeah. [02:19:39.040] What I what I would say to people is you [02:19:42.719] have the ability [02:19:44.960] on a religious sense. If God gave you [02:19:46.880] the ability, use it. [02:19:49.359] Don’t hide your light under a bushel. [02:19:52.720] On the real physical sense, we are going [02:19:56.560] into space. [02:19:59.520] You better be ready for it. [02:20:02.560] Okay? Because there are people who don’t [02:20:05.200] want us out there. [02:20:06.960] >> Wow. Wow. [02:20:09.760] >> Anyway, that’s that’s the message I [02:20:11.760] would leave. Yeah. [02:20:12.880] >> Beautiful. Beautiful. This has been an [02:20:14.399] absolutely [02:20:16.000] fun wild one. Thank you so much for [02:20:18.880] sharing all of these stories. Thank you [02:20:20.960] so much for everything you’ve you’ve [02:20:22.479] done for uh remote viewing for SAI for I [02:20:26.800] mean one of the things you know I got to [02:20:28.880] imagine that’s on your mind is like how [02:20:32.000] is the legacy of this going to continue [02:20:34.319] moving forward and you know like what [02:20:37.120] you know what is the destiny of the [02:20:39.600] human mind what is the horizon of the [02:20:41.439] human mind what what is it capable of [02:20:43.760] and people like you are are pushing that [02:20:45.600] forward my friend [02:20:47.760] >> I’m trying yeah and I realize when I [02:20:51.680] tell some of these events that happened [02:20:53.280] to me that if I were just a person off [02:20:56.800] the street, [02:20:58.720] I would absolutely not believe them. [02:21:02.000] And yet, like you said about the Monroe [02:21:04.319] Institute thing, when it happens to you, [02:21:08.640] you you can no longer deny it, [02:21:10.880] >> right? Yeah.